Bombardon as an ophecleide substitute

[Wyvern]

Paul, Wessex will have out exactly what you are looking for later this year. More details later...

[Bob Kolada]

Buy mine!

How much is yours Bob?

$1500. I've got more pics if anyone's interested.

[PaulMaybery]

Jonathan.

Very much interested. I already have your Wessex F Cimbasso in silver, and it is a fabulous instrument. It charms everyone who hears it and I've actually been using it quite a bit.

Will patiently wait for news on your instrument. Any hints on key and configuration will be welcomed.

Thanks for the news.

Paul

[PaulMaybery]

To Bob
Would be interested in seeing pics if you don't mind.
I'm trying to gather as much information as I can.
Many thanks in advance.
Paul

[PaulMaybery]

Hi Kiltie.
Good to know others have a similar interest in the old bombardon.
That bottom bow is the tricky part. In the old 19th-century aesthetic, it was often a pretty narrow bend. There is branch inside the old Conn Jumbo EEbs (just opposite the valve cluster) that I have been messing with. I'm not sure what I would like for a bore though. The cimbasso I already have is around .730 (roughly) and with the bass trombone size bell is very light and responsive and great intonation. I think the trick is to keep things pretty narrow for about the first 2/3ds. Actually the cimbasso bell is not that different from some of the old Conn Eb upright altos. Problem with the saxophone bow is that it has a tone hole smack in the middle of things, besides even with an alto I think it would be too wide. The other comparison between the bombardons and the ophicleides is that the bombardons I have seen are more trombone-like, whereas the ophicleides tend to be much more conical all the way through the horn. Unfortunately I have not been able to play any of those museum bombardons, but have had my chops on quite a few ophicleides. Part of what I would like is a horn that will play the upper range (middle C up to G) with the ease of a euphonium, a little huskier though, and still have a good bottom. For me, F is my preferred key. The lead pipe and mouthpiece receiver I believe would be a critical section of the instrument. And does one approach it like a bass trombone with a similar size mp or from the perspective of a tuba with something like an F solo mp. I could see a bocal type lead pipe (fashioned like a removable sousaphone neck). Two would be nice, one for a tuba mp the other for a bass trombone/euph mp. I have an antique trombone mp that has a hug shank and cup and fits a standard American shank receiver. (It makes Bydlo on the F tuba a piece of cake.) The shank is also long enough that it fits into the large shank euphonium and gives it more of a tuba sound. Problem my euph does not have enough push on the tuning slide to bring the pitch back up to 440.
Somehow I would try building the bombardon from with that particular MP in mind.

[Wyvern]

Any hints on key and configuration will be welcomed.

I will let you know that it uses ophicleide bell and bows without the tone holes. We are calling it a valved-ophicleide (although you could call it bombardon). It is inspired by original 19th century design. It is basically the missing link between the ophicleide and the tuba. Tonally with the mouthpiece we are supplying it sounds near ophicleide without the complicated fingerings and intonation problems.

Tony George who has been advising Wessex on the design says it will be ideal for playing early Verdi, as well as Berlioz, or Mendelssohn with modern orchestra. I am sure it will also have many other uses (civil war bands, brass quintet, recital use, etc.) - and will be easy for tuba players to pick up and play without learning a new instrument (although hopefully they will still be able to claim doubling fees!).

Initially it will be in Eb, and we may follow with F version, depending on the response.

I am excited about Wessex bringing out a completely new horn to extend tuba players tonal palette.

[PaulMaybery]

Jonathan.
For orchestral players in the US - I would indeed encourage an F version. I do understand in the UK the Eb Tuba is pretty standard in the orchestras and that will likely be your initial market.

Very excited to hear about your plans.

Any chance they could be built with just interchangeable F/Eb slides like the "Bubbie" and the Cimbasso.

[latuba]

Well, google doesn't help. Nor does searching for Syhre as he retired.

Don't come around here dropping these kind of bombs without more information!!

Well, I think my post was long enough to bring at least some information And there is no need to worry about not finding Mr Syhre on google - he was an old man and did not put very much information on the web. But you can ask me anything you want about it and I will try to answer as far as my knowledge goes. BTW - If you guys are interested, I am planning to put a demo vid on youtube soon.

[J.c. Sherman]

I should have google alerts on... it would've been ringing off the hook!

Thanks for the nice words spoken/written... and I'm looking forward to the valved ophicleide from Wessex (and trying out the ophi C... I have a feeling that I'll have to sell my Guichard soon!)

For the OP... I make custom instruments constantly, and I've thought often of making something as you suggest. Maybe I'll bump it up the list. FWIW, I've built a Euphonium-sized F tuba, and I wish I'd held onto it for reasons you mention. But it was excellent for playing duets with my bassoonist friend

The "Koladaphone" was one of my favorite instruments. Built as an Eb bass valve trombone, it was also able to handle the lot of an ophicleidist... though I'd suggest something akin to a Yamaha Bobo TT mouthpiece for that. Truly, it'd work well, I think.

My Eb valved ophicleide had a slightly larger bore to compensate for the more compact form... it worked great too!

Some important studies of cimbasso literature have suggested compensating Euphonium (possibly bell-front) for some early cimbasso literature. It would balance well, but the blend may be a bit too "tubistic".

Jonathan, I can't wait to see what you're planning. In the meantime, I'm finishing bringing my Besson "Prototype" Eb 3+1 back to life for my Brahams horn

J.c.S.

[latuba]

If you are able, play it against a tuba model that is more well known.

I will try and consider this when I make it. Is Rudi 5/4 F well known enough? I think, that is the most well known horn I own - Rudi Bayreuth is out of the game as it is BBb

[Bob Kolada]

http://jestaedt-instrumente.de/?grid_pr ... bchen-in-f

I nominate the 5 valve version as a bombardon/ophicleide(as close as you're going to get in a non-euph pitch version)/chimp alternate.