Microphone/live sound tissues

[adam0408]

I've been playing out live with a guitarist/ singer in different bands for several years now in different configurations. I handle the bass duties on tuba. We play bars mostly, so we always need fairly substantial p.a. support. The first problem is that I haven't found a good microphone solution. The way I have been doing it is putting a tom mic down the bell so it sits in the bottom bow. The sound this produces is not ideal. I want to find a mic solution that sounds warmer but still offers good attack and minimizes feedback and bleed from other instruments.

Secondly, the monitor situation is almost always put of control. Even after playing together for YEARS. Guitar guy likes his mix very loud, and I can rarely hear myself if his mix is where he likes it, even if we have completely separate monitors. The only way I can hear definition or articulation in my sound is if I bounce my sound off a wall. If I request to be louder we just play the loud game until I'm afraid of damaging my hearing. Is there some way to separate our monitors better and isolate the mixes so that I'm not getting constantly blown out by guitar? Sound guys have been no help. I really don't want to go to in ear monitors if I don't have to.

Thanks for the help.

[Tubainsauga]

A decent clip on mic really seems to be the way to go. Depending on the brand, they're not overly expensive and are probably the most elegant solution. If you're set on using a drum mic, they make goosenecks. http://www.thomann.de/gb/km_10000_mikro ... r_tuba.htm The classic on sousaphones seems to be a SM58 taped either to the bell or well down the bell. I agree it's a less than ideal sound though. As for the monitor situation, good luck...

[swillafew]

The guitarist you mentioned is in about 2 million bands. Guitarists behave exactly as you say. You already know how it works out. Shure clip on mics are not cheap, but they are wonderful. For about the same price, you can get a very playable bass guitar. A host of issues are relieved by doing this. The sound guys you mentioned are just a little bit more deaf than the guitarist. One person doing sound at a local establishment cut the lows out of my friends' two guitars, and my own sound emerged from the mud. Good luck.

[Tom]

In my opinion you don't have a microphone problem, you have a sound man problem and a bandmate problem.

Bandmate needs to get the level down and monitor guy needs to redo the mix...

If you're all getting the same mix, it's probably time to switch that up and get a monitor guy that can get you all your own mix so you don't have to deal with what someone else wants to hear as their mix with your only control being to turn it up or down.

If they're mixing monitors from FOH, that's probably part of the problem as they'll have no clue what's going on over on the stage unless they run a cue wedge (not something you can practically do at FOH) or wear in-ears they can cue up to each monitor mix. It is very challenging to have the same guy mix FOH and monitors from the same board at the same time, so hopefully you're not doing that. If you are, your band needs to explore getting a dedicated monitor guy.

Another thing regarding stage volume - if the monitor wedges are screaming loud and the guitar amps are on the stage and cranked up, life can be miserable. Maybe you can talk your bandmate(s) into going direct rather than running amps on the stage. This will work MUCH better if you use in-ears rather than open wedges though.

The only way to REALLY get isolation on monitors is to go in-ear. Wearing them takes getting used to (because they just about "seal" your ear off so you only hear what comes through the IEM), but once you do, you'll never use monitor wedges again if you can help it. However, using in-ears can be really NOT fun if you have to count on the bar band sound guy to get it right (as opposed to the band's own guy that -hopefully- is familiar with you and what you do).

I don't think your mic situation is as bad as you think it is. A tom mic dropped down the bell should be ok for your type of situation. From what you've described of the playing situation, going with something different isn't going to make that big of a difference. A clip mic on the bell rim might "sound" better, but will pick up more bleed from other instruments and monitor wedges. Maybe not a ton, but more than with any mic that is dropped down the tuba bell. Again, I say the problem is with your FOH and Monitor guy more than anything - and your bandmate's desire to have monitors running super hot is only making matters worse.

[adam0408]

Thanks for the replies guys. We do tend to use the same sound guy for all our gigs now, and he has gotten a lot better at making the band sound good. I do still have to encourage him to eq the tuba differently, otherwise he'll make it super bass heavy and it gets lost in the mix.

We generally do run different wedges and mixes for everyone, but last weekend we didn't for reasons that weren't clear to me. I think I'll just have to have the conversation with guitar guy about being too loud because he runs direct anyway so there's no extra amp noise coming out.

As far as switching to bass guitar, I do play and own a couple nice basses and a decent amp setup, but it really isn't right for the band. The only way I could make it fly with guitar guy is if I played upright, and I have zero interest in acquiring one of those monsters right now. I would also probably still have the same monitor issues I do now.