Downsizing Of Service Bands

[Dan Schultz]

There seems to be a trend to downsize the number and sizes of the service bands. It's time to write to your congressmen.

I think this is a serious issue. Discuss it but please don't turn this thread into anything political.

[Mark]

I understand why you don't want this to be political. However, I suspect that writing members of congress won't work while the Commander-in-Chief is anti-military.

[The Big Ben]

I understand why you don't want this to be political. However, I suspect that writing members of congress won't work while the Commander-in-Chief is anti-military.

Please. If CongressCritters can buy the military weapons that they don't need and haven't asked for, Congress can fund military bands.

[EdFirth]

This is just an observation. I was in the Army from 70' to 73' first in the band at Ft Lee, then at the one at West Point(in one enlistment). At that time the post bands were maybe 80 percent short timers like me and 20 percent "lifers" as they were lovingly referred to then. The West Point band was more like two thirds lifers. So a lot of the work force never got past E6 and only got the GI Bill package when they got out.Now, with the business in the toilet, those who get into a service band are going to stay, they can reach E9, retire after 20 years if they choose to, and get a nice pension that starts when they retire. No waiting till you're 65 here, and have medical coverage for life. A good deal to be sure but Much more expensive to the taxpayer for the same product. The bands I've heard over the years since I got out have been excellent and it's a shame they want to cut them back, but look at the orchestras, pit shows with more and more keyboards instead of horns, and, here in Central Florida the shrinking Dixieland bands that have gone from 7 pieces to mostly trios.The only solution I can come up with is that the service bands would go to a "core" group of lifers and the rest be 3 or four years. I know none of you guys or the guys in the bands want that. When I was at West Point there were 13 tuba players and there could be a parade, a funeral, and a school concert at the same time. Now there are 3 tuba players and they sometimes do a post review with one. I will make this observation though. If you go in out of high school(like I did) and go to the school of music where you(as tuba players) become proficient on bass and have two years of theory crammed down your throat in 6 months(they sent me directly to a band so I missed out on that) then play in a good group for the rest of your enlistment it is time Very well spent. I hope they can work it all out. Ed

[Radar]

I think the downsizing of the military bands is consistent with the overall downsizing of the military. My oldest son is a Major in the Army and knows several fellow officers who for lack of a better term were let go. That long deployments overseas are taking their tolls on our men and women in uniform and if we're going to support the current missions we have I certainly don't think any military downsizing is the right thing to do.

[swillafew]

I just heard about a major who retired and was back at work in the same office the next day as a contractor and getting more money for his time. I am sure the military was officially downsized in this process. The musicians may be doing this already, or could begin to do so.

[Three Valves]

Our military bandsmen should join AFSCME.

AFSCME would give millions to the usual suspects.

Not one of them would be laid off.

Case closed.

[Dan Schultz]

....So a lot of the work force never got past E6 and only got the GI Bill package when they got out.Now, with the business in the toilet, those who get into a service band are going to stay, they can reach E9, retire after 20 years if they choose to, and get a nice pension that starts when they retire. .....

One of the complaints I hear is that with the quotas that are in place (apparently to save money), it's getting more difficult to advance in pay grade. As a result, they choose to leave the service after twenty years as opposed to staying longer. There are lots of very good older musicians choosing to retire rather than to be 'stuck' in the same pay grade forever and there needs to be a better retention policy. Members of the service bands need to maintain a level of fitness and military bearing but it's not like they are on the 'fighting front'. Old guys should count for something more than simply being passed over for promotion because of some sort of quota.

[Three Valves]

Old guys should count for something more than simply being passed over for promotion because of some sort of quota.

Who do they think they are??

John Philip Sousa??

[ral1988]

The quality is getting better (most of the junior enlisted can play circles around the senior lifers), and most of us are bringing our professional freelancing abilities with us . However, the musicians in the regular bands (not special bands) need to prove their worth. The band I am in is not at a level to bring the entire band to play for the community. And for the past few years I have had to write out arrangements for various group of musicians (rock band, brass section, plus glee chorus for example) that can do the gig. I'm not sure as a tax payer how I feel about paying for a military band when members of that band avoid deploying, go to obsured amounts of military schooling, and are content with their playing ability.

It is sad that the ground forces band is going away but from observing their use around Fort Bragg, they weren't being used. The 82nd band down the street is requested before the ground forces. And I suspect with the merger (70 piece band plus 30 glee chorus) in the near future will bring more of the name recognition. There have been many times that our operations (82nd) had to send jobs to the ground forces band so they can do jobs because of how booked we were.


Just my two cents.

[oedipoes]

There seems to be a trend to downsize the number and sizes of the service bands. It's time to write to your congressmen.

Hmm, seems to be something global, and not only for service bands but also for all other professional bands or orchestras.

[Dan Schultz]

There seems to be a trend to downsize the number and sizes of the service bands. It's time to write to your congressmen.

Hmm, seems to be something global, and not only for service bands but also for all other professional bands or orchestras.

The BIGGEST problem I see with the Service Bands is that those affected directly don't have anything to say about how things are done. If anything positive is going to happen... it's going to be at the hands of the civilian taxpayers. As long as all the taxpayers can do is bitch about the money that's spent on defense, that's the way it's going to be.

I, for one, think that all of The Bands play a very important part in the overall military bearing of The Services and should not be looked upon only as a recruiting tool.

[EdFirth]

Dan, I applaud your passion. All the very best to you. Ed

[Pat S]

I was the Commander of our Air Force Theater Hospital in Balad AB Iraq back in the late 2000s. On one occasion we helo'd in an Army Dixieland Band to entertain our wounded warriors. Our American service members and staff loved the music, as you might expect. Guess what else? Our Iraqi patients LOVED the music. The positive impact on morale was absolutely incredible. I'm a huge fan of our military bands and it makes my heart ache to see them shrink.

[Pat S]

I was the Commander of our Air Force Theater Hospital in Balad AB Iraq back in the late 2000s. On one occasion we helo'd in an Army Dixieland Band to entertain our wounded warriors. Our American service members and staff loved the music, as you might expect. Guess what else? Our Iraqi patients LOVED the music. The positive impact on morale was absolutely incredible. I'm a huge fan of our military bands and it makes my heart ache to see them shrink.

Found a picture of the event:

No patients in the picture because we NEVER took identifying pictures of our patients. They were opposite the band in wheelchairs and stretchers, interspersed with staff.

[imperialbari]

From what I see in my own country and in a couple of neighbouring countries, it is not the politicians that are the foremost threats towards the military bands. It is the top military commander who wants the maximum in fighting power for the money allocated to the military.

Aside of the royal lifeguard we now only have two bands, which are located in relatively poor regions, one of them without a professional orchestra, the other traditionally having a very strong nationalistic tradition. If the military top had it their way, the two provincial bands had long gone, and the lifeguard band had been cut to half its present size.

OK, we also have a navy drum corps, which rather is a small brass band with piccolo flutes, but which for budgetary reasons cannot be called a band. The navy wanted music for its foreign visits, so it first made that corps out amateurs among the drafted sailors. Later on it has been enlisted sailors, but at a lower pay and under very much shorter contracts than with the army band players which have contracts until their 60th year.

The navy drum corps maybe is the most visible across the country, as it has a very active schedule of making drill displays at all sorts of local events.

Klaus

[lowpitchmoravian]

No problem getting bands back up to size ------Just donate a typical 50000 to 100000 $ ( Typically given by the 1 % ) to all congressmen and we'll have more band than infantry.-----Money and re-election is name of the game., folks.----Sad, Sad.

[Scott C]

As someone who spent a few years on the inside, I might offer some perspective.

Military Bands are always been asked to do more with less. It happens in time of War (build up), and in Peace (draw down). When looking around for something we can do without, Bands will take a hit. Like any major corporation, there is waste, and at times money is used unwisely. The reaction is to "do something" and the bands become leaner.

We can compare this to what is happening in the civilian world. Adjuncts are replacing professors. How many major schools have replaced a full time tuba professor over the last decade with an adjunct? The Brass Band of Battle Creek was threatened with their funding being pulled. Once the funding, or the chair is gone it almost never returns. These corporations that made the cuts are not placing a high value on the product; they are not willing to spend their treasure on music.

What this means to musicians is that you must be able to articulate very clearly what your music brings and the benefits. Writing ones Congressman will be half as effective as having a dynamic personality leading the band and having the communication skills and CEO grace to be that spokesman and advocate for the presence of music. The future of music relies on these personalities (i.e. Leonard Bernstein) who communicate so effectively and advocate tirelessly. Military bands don't identify these rare individuals very well. I can think of a few outstanding advocates (COL Arnold Gabriel), but most go along to get along.

My teacher Harvey Phillips, reminded us often that playing the tuba wasn't a job, the job was getting the gig, communicating with the patron/audience, and getting the next gig. When we give this up to the bean counters,we cease to have a say in the future of the Arts. When we program crap that no one wants to hear, don't engage our patrons, and don't advocate; our profession will suffer.

These bean counters will always find ways for us to become more efficient. We need to be out front communicating why the telling of the American story through music is beneficial. We need leaders that advocate tirelessly the benefit of military bands. We need bandsmen that can articulate the necessity of the arts and will share their passion with future generations.

There is no better gig than a Military Band, and I hope they are fully funded and doing what they do best, advocating for the arts, telling the American story, and entertaining Americans and our Allies for years to come.

[pgym]

there is waste, and at times money is used unwisely.

This is hard to understand when the guys I've known in military bands around here tell me how at the end of each year they scramble to 'spend all the money they have'. That's why we have military bands with handmade Nirschl's, handmade Baer's, etc, and the FIRST Shires alto trombone as I previously mentioned.

Another example: Why does an Air Force Band (not D.C.) need a contrabass trombone?

^^^^ THIS. EXACTLY.

[Three Valves]

When we program crap that no one wants to hear...

Who doesn't want to hear Sonata for Tuba in Six Octaves??