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Hello I am looking for new c tuba with limited budget.
I really should try the horn and need to find the right one. But I found that the wwbw and musiciansfriend(same horn) are selling the pt-6(rotary) silver plate one with really good price $10,600 and the MRP silver plate is usually cost 14,800. Is MRP worthy to pay 4,000 more compare to PT-6?

THANK YOU!!

Try both...

I have played both and strongly prefer the MRP-C (but I normal play a neptune so...). That said, I would probably not pay $4000 more for one. I also probably wouldn't buy a PT6 new as they come up used pretty often, but I'm cheap.

Gents: The instrument in question from wwbm is a "blemished" one so it is not new. I don't know what blemished means but for that discount, it must be B stock.... A new 3098 in silver MAP is $13300.00, the MRP_C in silver MAP is $14100.00. The 3098 is a 5/4 horn and the MrP is 5/4+ based on the Fafner bell and bottom bow.

The Merp has different bell and bottom bow. The rest is pretty much the same. Similar story with the difference between the Pt6 and the Neptune (and the PT7, for that matter).

I've heard the Merp is pretty good tuba, but haven't played one yet.

The Merp is a little smaller bell than the Neptune, which has a 20.5" bell... IMO, it's just too big.

I believe the Merp is a Fafner bell -- I guess it works pretty well, but that's also the economy of scale for Buffet group, why not use the same one big bell for multiple horns?

Yes the MRP uses the Fafner bell and bottom bow; it really has nothing to do with Buffet
Group as far as involvement or marketing as Dan was working on that horn before the merger.

Scubatuba wrote:Yes the MRP uses the Fafner bell and bottom bow; it really has nothing to do with Buffet
Group as far as involvement or marketing as Dan was working on that horn before the merger.

Well then, I stand corrected. Thanks!

58mark wrote:Serious question...

It's nice to see rotary horns on the upswing again, everything is cyclical

As someone who is just coming back from a ~7 year hiatus it's amazing to me how much the market has changed... when I "left" the then-new Conn tubas were the holy grail of all purpose tubas and had gone up in price by $1k/yr a few years in a row, now Tubenet hates them and they sell for under $3k? Academia and online classifieds were littered with $3500 Miraphone 186s left and right and now they're $9,000??? Hirsbrunners have fallen into the 4-figure range? Kanstul now makes tubas that cost more than a duplex in the midwest? Pretty big changes in under a decade, goes to show how fickle the market is.

So I basically slept from 2005-2015, were the market shifts as drastic between 1995-2005? 1985-1995?

You can obviously do business with whatever B&S tuba dealer you wish, but I'd suggest that you shop around.

For example, at Baltimore Brass, they have the MRP price listed on their website for a little over $1,000 LESS than the new price on a PT-6, not $4,000 more. I'm not going to call to verify that price as I'm not shopping for either of these models, but since you are, I'd definitely recommend you investigate further.

funkcicle wrote:
As someone who is just coming back from a ~7 year hiatus it's amazing to me how much the market has changed... when I "left" the then-new Conn tubas were the holy grail of all purpose tubas and had gone up in price by $1k/yr a few years in a row, now Tubenet hates them and they sell for under $3k? Academia and online classifieds were littered with $3500 Miraphone 186s left and right and now they're $9,000??? Hirsbrunners have fallen into the 4-figure range? Kanstul now makes tubas that cost more than a duplex in the midwest? Pretty big changes in under a decade, goes to show how fickle the market is.

So I basically slept from 2005-2015, were the market shifts as drastic between 1995-2005? 1985-1995?

It's just a new batch of "hot" must-have tubas, a new batch of young players, and significantly higher prices on new and recently-purchased-but-now-used tubas. Yep, some of the models that were hot in 2005 have fallen out of vogue.

Here's my opinion on all you really missed...

-Alan Baer went from Miraphone to working with Meinl Weston and developed a couple of CC tubas and big F tuba. The 6/4 sized model [6450] cracked the $20,000 ceiling when introduced and the /2 version [handmade] goes for over $30,000 new.

-The Meinl Weston Thor was introduced and has overtaken the Miraphone 129x tubas for those that want a piston CC that isn't a PT-6p. A new model just came out, the Ursus, which is a 4/4 version of the 6450...likely to be the next must-have tuba.

-Rotary F tubas are cool again and everyone that has one swears the low register doesn't suck. Big piston F tubas are so 2002!

-Chinese tubas are everywhere. Some are pretty good, apparently. They're cheap, but getting more expensive.

-Kanstul is trying to make some more "mainstream" tubas. I hear the model 90 CC is very good as is their small F tuba. I've never seen either of them in person.

-The Yorkbrunner seems to have [somewhat] fallen out of fashion. Several have come up for sale, used, for $15k or less. Other Hirsbrunner models seem to regularly sell under $10k used. Other companies have caught up to Hirsbrunner, pricing wise which may have taken a bite out of the Hirsbrunner resale prices???

-Lots and lots of mouthpieces are out there, many in stainless steel. Good stuff.

-I almost forgot...now it's cool to have a BBb tuba, especially to play in an orchestra.

And on tubenet we still get the normal questions about BBb vs. CC, pistons vs. rotors, lacquer vs. silver, what tuba is a 5/4 or 6/4, and so on...

Tom wrote:

funkcicle wrote:
As someone who is just coming back from a ~7 year hiatus it's amazing to me how much the market has changed... when I "left" the then-new Conn tubas were the holy grail of all purpose tubas and had gone up in price by $1k/yr a few years in a row, now Tubenet hates them and they sell for under $3k? Academia and online classifieds were littered with $3500 Miraphone 186s left and right and now they're $9,000??? Hirsbrunners have fallen into the 4-figure range? Kanstul now makes tubas that cost more than a duplex in the midwest? Pretty big changes in under a decade, goes to show how fickle the market is.

So I basically slept from 2005-2015, were the market shifts as drastic between 1995-2005? 1985-1995?

It's just a new batch of "hot" must-have tubas, a new batch of young players, and significantly higher prices on new and recently-purchased-but-now-used tubas. Yep, some of the models that were hot in 2005 have fallen out of vogue.

Here's my opinion on all you really missed...

-Alan Baer went from Miraphone to working with Meinl Weston and developed a couple of CC tubas and big F tuba. The 6/4 sized model [6450] cracked the $20,000 ceiling when introduced and the /2 version [handmade] goes for over $30,000 new.

-The Meinl Weston Thor was introduced and has overtaken the Miraphone 129x tubas for those that want a piston CC that isn't a PT-6p. A new model just came out, the Ursus, which is a 4/4 version of the 6450...likely to be the next must-have tuba.

-Rotary F tubas are cool again and everyone that has one swears the low register doesn't suck. Big piston F tubas are so 2002!

-Chinese tubas are everywhere. Some are pretty good, apparently. They're cheap, but getting more expensive.

-Kanstul is trying to make some more "mainstream" tubas. I hear the model 90 CC is very good as is their small F tuba. I've never seen either of them in person.

-The Yorkbrunner seems to have [somewhat] fallen out of fashion. Several have come up for sale, used, for $15k or less. Other Hirsbrunner models seem to regularly sell under $10k used. Other companies have caught up to Hirsbrunner, pricing wise which may have taken a bite out of the Hirsbrunner resale prices???

-Lots and lots of mouthpieces are out there, many in stainless steel. Good stuff.

-I almost forgot...now it's cool to have a BBb tuba, especially to play in an orchestra.

And on tubenet we still get the normal questions about BBb vs. CC, pistons vs. rotors, lacquer vs. silver, what tuba is a 5/4 or 6/4, and so on...

I love my Hirsbrunner and it was worth every cent. My firebird has an easier low register than my previous piston F tuba...

Bloke-

In my region, nearly 100% of band programs fall into one of those two camps. Probably more Miraphone than Yamaha but virtually nothing else except a very small number of Cerveny tubas here and there that were pushed hard by a now defunct local dealer.

Tom "really glad I don't have to deal with competitive bids when buying or selling and that my customers are not schools!"

Since we are now on the topic of BBb, if you haven't seen or played the B&S GR51 you should. It has a punchy low end, seems more maneuverable due to its height (39"), and comes in at a great price point. I'm told that custom did not sell a lot of BBb's so this horn has gone un noticed. Not any more! I think it is the new killer.

...but can you easily order spare parts yet?

As someone who regularly plays a PT6 and has played two MrP CCs, I feel like the MrP has slightly more consistent/easier response and articulation than the PT6. The PT6 still has that unbeatable sound.

I got to hear a tuba player in a major symphony play both for me back-to-back, which confirmed my belief that the PT6 has "that" sound. The MrP still sounds great, but darker (more like a BBb maybe) and with perhaps with less projection.

tl;dr You may find the MrP easier to play, but the PT6 wins on sound.

First off, yes parts are available if you are an authorized dealer, if not, pm me.

Second Many believe that the Wisemann 900 wins in a 3-way competition. Uh, sorry but are you honestly comparing a Chinese tuba to a German one? And who is the third in this playoff? Wisemann makes some good stuff but the Chinese brass will never be as good as the German brass, period. sorry if you don't agree.

Thank you Idine- Dan's intent with the MrP was for it to sound more BBb like.
Thank you Curmudgeon- from someone who has actually played a GR51.....

Scubatuba wrote:First off, yes parts are available if you are an authorized dealer, if not, pm me.

Second Many believe that the Wisemann 900 wins in a 3-way competition. Uh, sorry but are you honestly comparing a Chinese tuba to a German one? And who is the third in this playoff? Wisemann makes some good stuff but the Chinese brass will never be as good as the German brass, period. sorry if you don't agree.

Thank you Idine- Dan's intent with the MrP was for it to sound more BBb like.
Thank you Curmudgeon- from someone who has actually played a GR51.....

Funny, I remember people saying the same thing about Japanese brass (Yamaha)...
How would you compare the new Chinese made Eastman CC 4/4 tuba developed by Matt Walters to German made or American made brass products? Oh, and I think that same Chinese company owns Shires and Haynes (flutes) in this country...how does Shires compare to German brass? A friend of mine back in the early '70's saved enough money to buy himself a new car that everyone said was junk...a very small orange car... think the name of it was Honda...how'd they turn out?
But at least I am writing this on an American Company product--an Apple iPad... now where are they made?
Never say never....we live in a global economy whether we like it or not...
Mark

PS. I have played the MRP CC & the PT-6 tubas...nice tubas.

bloke wrote: I have a Chinese bronze Clara-bell on my tuba...

bloke "whose photoshopping abilities are absolutely astonishing, are they not?"

cowbell1.jpg

You have no idea how much that made me laugh!

Scubatuba wrote:
Second Many believe that the Wisemann 900 wins in a 3-way competition. Uh, sorry but are you honestly comparing a Chinese tuba to a German one? And who is the third in this playoff? Wisemann makes some good stuff but the Chinese brass will never be as good as the German brass, period. sorry if you don't agree.

Having played the German versions of the Wisemann 900 and the Packer/Sterling F I wouldn't buy the German versions even if the prices were lowered to that of the Chinese versions because I think that for these two models the Chinese versions (at least the ones I've played) have better playing characteristics than the German ones.

So yes, if someone offered me one of the Packer/Sterling Fs or a PT15 for $4500 I'd take the Packer. Same for the Wisemann and the PT6P. But what do I know?