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Adding a 5th valve to a King 2280

Postby Mark Finley » Sat Apr 16, 2016 10:33 am

I can get a .591 rotary valve pretty easy, but what I would really like is a 625. Does anybody know of a company that makes a 600-625 rotary valve?

I know in theory miraphone makes a kaiser euphonium with a 610 valve section, but those are so rare they might as well not exist. The chances of finding a horn to use for parts isn't very likely

Thinking of making my king 2280 into a 5 valve euphonium
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby KiltieTuba » Sat Apr 16, 2016 10:43 am

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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby Mark Finley » Sat Apr 16, 2016 10:48 am

Thanks, I just found a cerveny they might be perfect too.

I had to look at all 10000 rotary euphoniums thru offered to find it

http://www.cerveny.biz/bariton/cep_541_4mr.php
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby bloke » Sat Apr 16, 2016 10:53 am

If (??) you can get one from a Jinbao importer, Jinbao makes that copy of the Meinl-Weston 186 BBb with a 16mm bore size.
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby Mark Finley » Sat Apr 16, 2016 11:01 am

Wow, I didn't know anybody made rotary valve tubas in that bore, ever


Good tip, I'll see if i can find one
Last edited by Mark Finley on Sat Apr 16, 2016 11:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby bloke » Sat Apr 16, 2016 11:03 am

58mark wrote:Good tip


That's why Sean Chisham pays me 20¢/post. :P
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby Bob Kolada » Sat Apr 16, 2016 11:50 am

Where is the .625 measurement?
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby Mark Finley » Sat Apr 16, 2016 12:11 pm

Down stream side of the main tuning slide. (need to double check though)
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby bloke » Sat Apr 16, 2016 12:28 pm

58mark wrote:Down stream side of the main tuning slide. (need to double check though)


next size up (.656") is one of those rotors harvested from an Olds 2-valve G-contrabass bugle.
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby Mark Finley » Sat Apr 16, 2016 12:38 pm

I thought about using one if those for my Eb 5th valve project until the YEB-381 valve fell into my lap

Another option to a 5th valve is just converting the cool spring loaded 3rd valve slide for use on the 1st valve. About the only note I'm wanting to tune is low Eb, and a spring loaded 1st valve would give me that. The 3rd valve slide have these nice stockings built into them (like trombone inner slides) , I wish they were used on the 1st slide too
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby the elephant » Sat Apr 16, 2016 12:53 pm

bloke wrote:
58mark wrote:Down stream side of the main tuning slide. (need to double check though)


next size up (.656") is one of those rotors harvested from an Olds 2-valve G-contrabass bugle.


I was about to add that. I have a box full of those guys, but I am using all of them.

HIJACK TIME!!!

If anyone has the pressed-in rotor back bearing plate or the screw-on back cap for one of these rotors I will gladly pay you for them!!!!!!
I got nothin'…
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby bigtubby » Mon Apr 18, 2016 12:34 pm

I have an ancient 3 valve F tuba that my records state is 16.5mm (.640). It is sort of a toss-up between restorable and scrap, you might be able to scab tubing and crooks from it as well.

If you might be interested in using that I will double check my measurements.
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby Mark Finley » Mon Apr 18, 2016 12:54 pm

That might be perfect, thanks
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby bloke » Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:42 pm

I would wonder what the bore size is here, and what condition some of these rotor assemblies (particularly the less-used #'s 3 & 4) might be in - once acid-cleaned.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-F-TUBA-/331834414743
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby tubapix » Mon Apr 18, 2016 5:26 pm

Something like this?

http://www.hornguys.com/products/stauff ... ium-silver" target="_blank
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby Mark Finley » Mon Apr 18, 2016 5:40 pm

tubapix wrote:Something like this?

http://www.hornguys.com/products/stauff ... ium-silver" target="_blank" target="_blank



Similar concept, but the yamaha is a dependent valve placed inside the 4th valve tubing. Plus the bore size of the Yamaha is much smaller
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby Mark Finley » Fri Jun 03, 2016 8:35 pm

at ITEC I did the unthinkable. I broke out my King Euph and did an A/B with the adams. I have to say it held its own for tone and response, and I would call it equal for intonation for everything above low Eb

As for Eb and below that, I'm getting serious again about adding a 5th valve to it, so I'm still looking for either a 16mm rotor or .625
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby Bob Kolada » Sun Jun 05, 2016 9:55 am

Kanstul contrabass trombones (used to?) have that as one of their valve sizes.
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby Mark Finley » Sun Jun 05, 2016 10:18 am

Bob Kolada wrote:Kanstul contrabass trombones (used to?) have that as one of their valve sizes.


Good tip. they list as .630. I haven't had much luck getting kanstul to answer questions, but I might give it a shot again
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Re: Need an odd size rotary valve

Postby Mark Finley » Sun Jun 05, 2016 10:49 am

after looking at the contrabass trombone valve, I think the Cerveny 16mm oval euphonium is still a better bet for fitting in with the Layout of the king

I know cerveny parts take a while to get, but it is possible. I think I'm going to do this, just because I like a project and having something unique

here's another thought.... I wonder what the result would be of putting the rotary valve on the large side of the main tuning slide? I could see this as being an advantage, because the disruption of the air would be minimized by the larger tubing, and the a larger valve would be easier to locate

Joe? Matt? Dan? thoughts?

Edit: a little research shows that a 750 valve is NOT east to locate. Not sure they even exist
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