TubeNet

Over Spring Break, I flew my Mirafone 1291 on Northwest Airlines in a $500 flight case. When I reached my destination, all the case latches and edging were ripped off, hinges bent, and the tuba inside sustained $4300 of damage. I immediately filed a claim with Northwest and it was sent to their corporate offices, and today I received notification that Northwest would not pay for any repair on the tuba, only the case. This seems a bit unfair. Does anyone know a better way to go about getting compensation? Should I let my insurance company fight for money? Are there any laws in this issue? If anybody has had success, I'd like to know how. In the meantime, don't fly Northwest.
-McLain Pray
freshman, Michigan State U.

Contact the President of the airline via snail mail. Be courteous, but firm in your letter. You can find information at:

http://www.nwa.com/plan/guide12.html

Good luck!

Funny, the same thing just happened to me on Northwest. They claimed that because there was no damage to the case they don't feel that the horn could have been damaged. I ended up getting into a huge arguement with the general manager of that airport and was told that going corporate wasn't worth it. In the meantime I decided to just file the claim through the insurance company (allstate). They took care of it really quickly. Still really frustrating though!!!
-Christian

I can't really help you in your current situation, but I'd like to suggest that for the future that you get instrument insurance through Clarion Ins. This way you would never have to fight with the airline over compensation, which I'm sure is a nightmare. Clarion has the reputation of handling all sorts of claims quickly and effortlessly. Plus, it is fairly inexpensive (around $150/year). Good luck.

The same thing happened to me last year. I flew home from school and NW lost my tuba somewhere between Lincoln NE and St. Louis. My tuba finally arrived two days later and the back side of the bell was caved in. I wrote letters, made phone calls, and made a trip back to St. Louis airport. Neither NW or insurance would cover the charges. I finally gave up the battle and decided to have the horn repaired in Omaha. If you find out anything concerning NW let me know.

My Dad works for an insurance company and I was told that as long as you are a not a professional musician (which includes students) instruments are covered under homeowner's insurance. You might want to look into that.

chevy68chv wrote:My Dad works for an insurance company and I was told that as long as you are a not a professional musician (which includes students) instruments are covered under homeowner's insurance. You might want to look into that.

While that is true, homeowner's insurance breaks everything down into catageries and there are limits on each category. For instance you might have $30,000 in coverage on belongings but only $2000 might be for things like musical instruments, plus there would be a deductable which might be $500.

Personal article coverage with a professional rider on a tuba is fairly cheap. I think mine might be a couple hundred dollars for the entire year.

While unfortunate, the airline details their limits on liability on the tickets. It would likely take a lawsuit to attempt to reclaim damages.

I recently had success (two weeks ago) with filing such a claim through homeowner's insurance. Same type of tuba, same type of case, same amount of damage. They (Wolverine Mutual Insurance) ended up replacing my tuba (minus a 500 dollar deductible) and letting me keep the salvage. It couldn't hurt to ask.

As a repairman that has gone to the airlines on several occasions for customers, and my own equipment, They will pay if you push the proper buttons. Here are things to consider:
1. was the case a true ATA approved flight case? Extruded edges, recessed handles, and I believe they ask for 3/8 ply wood? Possibly 1/2? Can't remember...
2. Did you sign a limited release form? Even if you did, you can still scream about it being in a flight case and that there is no way that this should happen..
3. I encourage everyone to take a before pic of their horn when it is checked.
4. Was the case locked? You said the latches were ripped off, did security rip them off trying to inspect it?
5. Find out who is is in charge of baggage for your area, and then the midwest and the area that you flew from. Contact the president of Northwest. I might be tough, but you should be able to get a name.
6. get three estimates to fix the horn, and take tons of pics. of the dammage before you let anyone do any repairs.
7. With dammage worth $4300, I'd be looking for a new horn out of them.
Now I will say, if it wans't in a flight case, You may be hosed,
but I would still attempt to get them to pay. Remember, the squeeky wheel gets the grease. Be a @@@@@....
Hope it all works out.
For those of you that are flying in the next few months, your best line of defence is your camera and a heavy duty case that it dosent' matter what they do, the horn will be fine.
Check out the Unitec cases. I have not had ANY dammage to the horn OR the case. Truely a product that CAN withstand the Sampsonite Gorilla!
Good luck,
Alan Baer

Couple questions....1) Did you show the horn to the baggage office immediately upon arrival? Often, if you show the damaged horn to them immediately upon arrival before you even leave the airport, you will get confirmation on site from the personnel in the office that the tuba and case were indeed damaged during flight and/or handling. If you leave and come back, they often will say they can't verify what you claim and you're generally out of luck.

2) Did you sign any kind of agreement before your flight left releasing the airline from liability for damage to the instrument? If so, you're SOL.

3) If you answered yes to 1 and no to 2...my advice is to not mess around with the underlings, go directly to the supervisor. They're the only ones with any real power to get things moving quickly. Be firm, and don't take no for an answer. Simply say that what happened is unacceptable and they are indeed responsible. With even average handling, horns in hard cases will make it ok, most of the time. It's like having an egg in a jar....if you shake the jar hard enough, the egg inside will break.

Most companies have the policy that if there is no damage to the case, then they are not responsible for the contents. But if there is significant visible damage, you can usually get what you're after. It may not cover the whole cost, but a good chunk of it. It's been my experience....just refusing to take no for an answer will get you some kind of compensation.

That said....I agree that having your own instrument insurance is a really smart idea, especially if you travel often. And always have your horn insured for more than it's worth. Scott said it right, that they process any claims faster than any airline and it's less hassle.

Sorry this happened to you! I've been there as well, and it truly sucks! But, take it for what it's worth...learn from it if it helps you make a better decision next time; and hope you get something back from this one.

Good luck!

Steve O.

Go buy a VW bus and drive all over creation trying to win the coveted 30k/annum "position." And IF you do it THAT way, being a member of the freeway Philharmonic when you've "arrived" won't be a chore!

HAHAHAHAHA

I really enjoyed that.

All of that aside, when my concert band went to Germany two years ago, we flew KLM (?) on the way and NW on the way back. Northwest does indeed suck at handling baggage, as they pretty much destroyed one of our tuba cases and one of the tuba bells. Thankfully enough, my director was able to get them to pay up to repair the tuba and get a new (very nice) case. So there, amidst all the dismal stories, I offer a glimmer of hope.

I have a question: Can the TSA deside not to let you board the plane with 20-30lbs of metal in a bag if they so choose? If they can then what do you do? Solution to the problem....Just buy the extra insurance! Its a once a year expence, you can fly all you want, and if there is damage the insurance company will pay and then light a fire under the carrier if they pay enough claims. For those who want to buy a seat, better hope the TSA doesnt decide to change the rules on you at the last minute if the alert color changes. (make sure you get replacement cost insurance)

If the damage is their fault, then it is absolutely their responsibility, plain and simple. Your responsibility is making sure that you've done everything that you can do to prevent damage to the instrument. Every airline plainly says that they won't pay for damage to luggage/cases, but unless you sign otherwise they are required by law to cover any damage caused to the contents of your baggage while it was entrusted to their care(again, unless it's your fault, which is what they will always assume). Their rule of thumb in this case is "if there's no damage to the case, then it is your fault".. of course if there is damage to the case, then it is easily proved otherwise.

Go to your local repair expert and have them write a letter on their letter head explaining exactly how the damage occured.. they will view this as something that can be used as "expert testimony" in court. In short, that's how you get your hand around their testicles. A few thousand dollars is nothing to them.. I know for a fact, specifically with Northwest, that even lower level service reps(basically, people who print the tickets) are authorised to write off up to $4k without consulting a superior.. unless something has changed drastically in the last year, I'm surprised you've had so much trouble with them.

My experience is this: I travelled cross country for a weekend.. when I returned home there were FOOTPRINTS all over my case, the valves had been pushed down into the horn, and the bell looked like a stained glass window. I consulted over the phone with a rep at the LOCAL airport(not corporate) and was told to do what I mentioned above(the letter). It took about 5 weeks, but I received a check for $2700(repair cost was $2900), a SIGNIFICANT airline travel voucher(paid for several subsequent trips), and I will receive double WorldPerks miles for the rest of my life(which equates pretty much to 1 free trip for every 3 paid trips). You should settle for nothing less, and one should absolutely not be intimidated into buying a seat for their horn because of an airline not taking responsibility for baggage employees who don't properly perform their jobs.

I would add, however, that once it's all cleared up, you should get a different make of tuba case(fool me twice, shame on me). While the damage inflicted on my horn was absolutely not my fault, if I were naive enough to travel again with the same type case and have the damage occur again, it would then absolutely be my fault. I made my own tuba case after that... it's a lot heavier and incurs overweight fees about 50% of the time, but in 11 flights so far I've had zero damage that I haven't been able to fix with a can of black spraypaint.

...that's my $.03. What a stressful thing to have to deal with, I almost feel your pain. I hope to God it all works out for the better!

anony"who remembers the pain in his gut when he went crying to his studio prof about his bashed up tuba"funk

funkcicle wrote:I made my own tuba case after that... it's a lot heavier and incurs overweight fees about 50% of the time, but in 11 flights so far I've had zero damage that I haven't been able to fix with a can of black spraypaint.

Would you be interested in a write up on that case?
Materials and methods used. For example how'd you fit the interior to your horn?
What's the interior lined with?

I need to repair/improve/replace a few cases.

Thanks for all of your help. I'll definitely write a letter to the president and include my repairman's expert testimonial. Also, the tuba is on homeowner's, and it sounds like they'll get me a new horn, but I don't want to stick it all on them if I could get something from Northwest.
Just to answer some of your questions: my case was ATA approved, I didn't sign any limited liability agreement, and I watched the inspectors lock it after they inspected it, so it was just mistreated - maybe it fell out when the pilot lowered the landing gear.
Thanks again,
McLain

Doc wrote:On the rare occasion I fly w/an instrument, I purchase a seat for it.

I would caution against relying on having an extra seat for your tuba on the plane. Many of you may have gotten away with that sometimes, but the airlines have EVERY right to decide to require you to check the tuba, even if you have purchased a seat for it. There are obvious safety issues with having such a large metal object in an airplane seat.

I know of instances where someone had purchased a seat for their tuba, but the flight crew required him to check the tuba. It's frustrating, but totally within the airlines rights.

When this happens (and you can't really predict when it will), it could leave you in a situation where you are forced to either (1) get off the flight; or (2) check your tuba without it being in a proper flight case, since you were expecting to have it on board.

I think the best solutions are to invest in a good flight case, and to make sure you have insurance.

McLain Pray wrote:Over Spring Break, I flew my Mirafone 1291 on Northwest Airlines in a $500 flight case. When I reached my destination, all the case latches and edging were ripped off, hinges bent, and the tuba inside sustained $4300 of damage. . . .

Click here for some general tips on transporting musical instruments from the US TSA (Transportation Security Administration).

I like the idea of getting your own insurance coverage, preferably as a rider to a homeowners or renters liability policy.

Also, a professionally made flight case is mandatory. Last year I witnessed an airline refuse to accept very durable, home-made, plywood containers. The containers were very heavy, but they would have damaged any other luggage that dared touch them when cargo shifted. Who needs the additional worry of having no way to transport your tuba when the plane leaves in one or two hours?

International airlines might cite Article 22 of the Warsaw Convention, which contains a libility cap on baggage (250 FRFs (French francs) per kilogram, converted to a gold standard by the Montreal Additional Protocol 2, now converted to Euros: FRF / 6.55957 = EUR)). If you buy a seat for the tuba, then Article 22, paragraph 3, caps liability at 5,000 French francs per passenger.

Even under the Warsaw Convention, international airlines and their passengers can negotiate (sometimes incorrectly called insurance, when the airline is in fact contracting for a specific warranty), usually for a fee, a higher "declared sum." I haven't flown internationally with a tuba, but I would recommend getting smart about the carrier's policies and options for extra coverage before buying tickets.

Here's information regarding baggage carriage for Northwest:

Limits of Liability For customers who have traveled on a domestic itinerary (defined as the 48 contiguous United States, Alaska and Hawaii) liability for the loss of, damage to, or delay in the delivery of personal property or luggage is limited to $2,500 per ticketed passenger, unless a higher value was placed on the luggage and applicable charges were paid at the time the property was checked into Northwest's care.

You can read their entire "contract of carriage" here if you wish to:
http://www.nwa.com/plan/contract2.pdf

"When I reached my destination, all the case latches and edging were ripped off, hinges bent, and the tuba inside sustained $4300 of damage."

It makes a difference where you got your $4300 figure, additionally EVERYTHING needs to be in writing...repair estimates, new case cost, potential new tuba cost, etc., etc., etc.

Insurance

An absolute must. Flying or not. Get your horn, gigbag, case, etc. insured. Do it either for what you paid (must provide invoice) or replacement cost, which is what I would suggest. Be sure that it covers theft, vandalism, fire, airline damage, etc., etc., etc. My policy covers everything except insect infestation (honestly...) and it's only $200 something-or-other a year for two horns, flight cases, and gig bags.

Case

If your're going to fly, you have to have one of these:







This won't cut it:



Documentation:

Take tons of pictures before you ever leave on a flight with a camera that can date stamp. Then take pictures of how the horn was packed. It's not a gaurantee that they'll cave in, but pictures never seem to hurt.

Tickets vs. Flight Cases

Yes, some people have purchased seats for their horns and have flown right next to them all over the world. However, for most people that just isn't practical. Buying 1 or 2 seats for a horn, getting them through the airports, security is a bear (good luck getting them through the x-ray machine templates), and actually getting the counter agent and flight attendants to let you take it on the plane is a hastle and a half. On the other hand, getting a flight case on the plane only requires dealing with one person, one time and often additional costs can be totally avoided and it can be loaded as a regular piece of checked baggage. Get a good, real flight case that fits well, pack it carefully, lock it after the inspections. No, it doesn't prevent the horn from being stolen or from being run over by a freak bulldozer that happens to be on the runway, but I think the practicality factor is huge here and that buying seats for tubas is an even bigger risk (what would you do if they refused to allow you to 'seat' your tuba?) than checking them in a flight case.

...and by no means consider a flight case (such as WJ or Anvil) a substitute for insurance! My brother worked for a time as a baggage handler at O Hare and the stories he told about the stuff that went on when things got "boring" would curl your toenails.

One time, my dad checked a tuba as baggage...WITH NO CASE. The worst that happened was a bent 4th valve lever.

On another occasion I packed two very expensive 18" woofers ($1000 each) into a box and checked them as baggage. When I got to my destination, the box was opened and the woofers were completely destroyed and in pieces. Apparently someone thought that these two speakers held face to face with strong zip ties looked like an atomic bomb, so they took the speakers out, cut all the zip ties, inspected the speakers to make sure they werent bombs, and threw them back into the box with the weight of one resting upon the fragile cone of the other. Then, I suppose, my now trashed box became the foundation for a pile of baggage. I discovered that no matter how carefully you pack something, the airline is NOT required to carefully repack something after they inspect it.

Checked baggage is for clothes.

-Eric