Best

[CJ Krause]

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[TubaRay]

Nope. I see your's is, however. Congratulations! What does it really mean?

[CJ Krause]

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[Dan Schultz]

Best 100 Communities for Music Education in America, 2004.
Is yours here?

NOPE! Doesn't really surprise me since it appears that the public schools here (Evansville, Indiana) are trying their best to eliminate music altogether. They cut all the K-6 programs and it looks like they will ax the middle schools next. Don't you wonder how Yamaha makes the determinations? Do you reckon it's done by how many new horns are sold? Kind of like the way the feds determine the unemployment figures.

[Matt G]

The school district I used to be in as a high school student is the only florida district on the list (Hillsborough County, Fl, where Tampa is).

There wasn't really a great school of music for college players there. The two schools with any program are USF and the University of Tampa.

I would like to see what the grading criteria were for the generation of this list. That is what would validate the results more than just the results themselves. Otherwise, it just looks like the top 25 blondes list that E! television puts out.

[CJ Krause]

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[CJ Krause]

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[TubaRay]

Charlie, I wasn't taking offense to your original post. I was merely questioning what the poll was attempting to measure. Your statement concerning what band directors are doing is absolutely dead center perfect. As I see it, the type of program you describe is attractive to some who really like marching band. It is not very attractive to those who really like music. It is also not attractive to many others, including those who do not wish to invest such large amounts of time in repetitive activities(i.e.--repeating that drill over and over). I have decried this manner of running a band program for some time now. I used to teach in 4A and 5A and have since gone to teaching in a very small(1A) school where I am not forced to play that game. I am not without problems, but the problem you describe is not one of mine.

Thank you for stating what you have about marching bands.

[Joe Baker]

I think you can get a very good idea what the criteria of the list might be by reading some of the other info. The organization is clearly an advocacy group for more money to be spent on music ed. I'm not at odds with that goal, mind you, but there are other measures than tax dollars spent. I am familiar with a dozen or so of the districts named, and every one is a wealthy district that spends a lot of money on music ed, just as they also spend a lot on math, English, football uniforms, and everything else.

And, putting out big bucks, they do tend to produce more quality students, athletic teams and musicians. I say "good for them", this is a very worthwhile way for wealthy folks to spend their money. But I still think this is a disingenuous and, frankly, cynical way of measuring the top 100 music districts.
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Joe Baker, whose son goes to a school with VERY fine bands, and who pays a huge band fee because the district doesn't fund it well.

[TubaRay]

Joe has hit the point right on the head. At least in my opinion, he has. The list is a virtual Who's Who of wealthy districts. I should qualify that to say that is true for the districts I have any knowledge of. I agree with Joe B. that I like it that some districts spend that money on the arts. Obviously, to me that is a good thing.

I guess I was a little reluctant to come out and say this in the beginning of the thread. The simple fact is that the wealthier areas generally have better schools. I see this as a fact of life. The question as to why this is true is one which could be debated at length. I have taught in both wealthy and poor districts during my career. I believe there are some logical reasons why some schools are better than others. Most of those reasons have nothing to do with any outright form of discrimination. To put it simply, some populations put more emphasis on education than others. In our society, education plays a major role in determining where we are able to plug into it. For instance, I grew up very poor. My parents, I believe uncharacteristically for their standing, placed a great deal of emphasis on education. Through their urging and encouragement, and through that of others in the community, I went on to college. Today, though not rich by any means, I have a greater standing in the community around me than my parents ever came close to attaining. This is due largely to my being "educated."

I guess I have rambled a bit. I hope I have in some small measure explained my original reaction to this subject.

[Rick Denney]

...Furthemore, by my quick scan of the list, Roanoke was the only VA system on the list, and frankly it is very hard to give much credence to a list that doesn't include at least one of the Northern Virginia school districts (Fairfax, etc.).

I was similary surprised not to see Fairfax on the list, or even Loudoun, even if funding is the only criteria.

When I went to high school in Texas (lo these many moons past), marching was something we did to get to concert season. In those days, there was little glory in wearing uniforms and marching in straight lines, and the music got the emphasis. But we were a big-city school district with highly limited resources, and regularly got trounced by the wealthy suburban districts who were spending ten times what we were. But we didn't really care; what we did get led to an effective educational and musical experience.

We who defend music education often do so on the basis that it is just as academically rigorous as learning a language. We talk about the importance of learning how to read musical notation, how to read those instructions in Italian, and how to train our minds to perform in accordance with those instructions but still put something of ourselves into it. Guess what? English teachers do exactly the same thing. They teach vocabulary and grammar, and the put that together with the study of literature. Then they force the students to reproduce what they have learned by creative writing.

Math is the same. Teachers start with arithmetic and teach basic operations (grammar), basic symbolism and abstraction (vocabulary), and the lead us through classic proofs (literature) and finally expect us to solve problems creatively.

Having made this grand argument that music is an academic subject on a par with learning language and mathematics, we then completely undermine it by spending the first half of the year learning how to walk in straight lines, and spending the second half of the year in rote memorization of five pieces of banal music for contest. So much of it is geared towards providing the director with evidence of his accomplishment in the form of gilded plastic trophies, rather than in the musical experience and learning of the students.

It's the same as if an English teacher spent the first half of the year teaching kids to line up carefully and scream limericks for the amusement of a crowd, and then spend the second half of the year memorizing five short poems to recite before some judges. No vocabulary; no grammar; no exposure to a range of literature, short and long; and little or no creative writing.

No wonder the education establishment doesn't take music seriously. No wonder they think music is an extra-curricular activity like sports. We treat it that way.

Rick "thinking that it doesn't take a big budget to create worthwhile musical experiences, but it does take a big budget to put more gilded plastic on the shelf" Denney

[Dan Schultz]

at all the schools i teach at in Plano, Lewisville and Carrollton, band starts in the 6th grade. i see nothing wrong with that.

Band here always started in the 6th grade, too. However, when I say they cut the music programs out of K-6, I'm talking about ALL the music programs... not just band.