Fred Geib's original Sander CC tuba

[Sam Gnagey]

In October, 2015 I ought this horn from an old friend, Bob Woodbury, when he quit playing for health reasons. Bob, my father and I played in a concert band in Greenville, OH in the 1960s when he was a student of Sammy Greene's at CCM. I've enjoyed having the instrument but didn't realize how significant the tuba's history was until Dave Detwiler posted an old photo here of the tuba section of the Pryor Band from 1904. The picture shows who Dave thought was Herman Conrad holding this tuba. However, after some facial comparison and research, it turns out that the photo is of Fred Geib. The tuba is distinctively different than any other Sander that I've seen, (I also own one from the later, Wolfstein period.) The wrap of the valve tubing is more traditional, but the valve cluster is the same construction and set up as later Sander horns. The fingering system has the 4th valve pitched at two whole-steps (2&3).The bell is stamped Sander Kaiserslautern which indicates that it was built before 1892 when Sander moved production to Wolfstein. We think it may have come over from Germany with Geib when he emigrated in the late 1880s. Bob told me that he had acquired it through Lou Rivetti who had found it at auction in Navy stores at Erie PA. Bob believes it ended up there when Geib went to the Marine band and had to play Conn BBb instruments. While I don't have any written documentation that this was Geib's the photographic evidence seems quite strong. I'd appreciate any information or photos of Geib with an early Sander tuba like this.

[bisontuba]

Way cool!!

[bort]

That's amazing! Different from the Sander you are selling (as in, are the physical measurements and size different? I know those are two different tubas).

Congrats, glad this piece of history has a worthy home!

[Paul Scott]

Interesting information. I have a Sander F tuba stamped Kaiserslautern and I had no idea that it was that old. This instrument also had a 4th valve = 2-3 setup but someone converted it to the coventional 4= flat 1-3. A very lightweight tuba that sports hollow rotors.

[bisontuba]

Interesting information. I have a Sander F tuba stamped Kaiserslautern and I had no idea that it was that old. This instrument also had a 4th valve = 2-3 setup but someone converted it to the coventional 4= flat 1-3. A very lightweight tuba that sports hollow rotors.

Pics??

[Matt Walters]

that this was Geib's the photographic evidence seems quite strong.

Sam,
Any history about a leadpipe change? Your tuba has the leadpipe laying on the top branch before going into the 1st rotor. The two older pictures show a similar horn with the leadpipe going straight across and under the 1st valve loop before going into a much sharper turn back into the 1st rotor.

[Sam Gnagey]

The discrepancies that are mentioned had occurred to me. There is no information about the lead pipe being changed. However there are obvious signs that it was removed and perhaps replaced. There is very little taper present to it. It also has a huge, early-Alexander size receiver unlike my later Wolfstein Sander. The main slide has a non-original, mismatching brace on it which may indicate that the slide crook was replaced as well. Over the course of the 140 year life of a tuba that was heavily used for most of that period, one would expect that parts would wear out and be replaced. In any case this is a very, very rare model of a Sander CC tuba which leads me to suspect there may only be this example in existence here.
I admit that without a documented paper trail some doubt remains that this instrument is what I believe it to be. My post is somewhat in hope that someone in this community will come up with more evidence to support my belief or strong evidence to reject it. I'm a scientist and skeptic at heart and always welcome the null hypothesis.