What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

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Donn
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by Donn »

I've also read "... the smaller the mouthpiece", but it depends. One player's main ambition is to avoid sounding "woofy", another might have a kind of bright nature tone ... I imagine you have a couple different mouthpieces already to experiment with. Anyway, I use a Faxx HB Helleberg on the Holton, and that's what everyone should use on everything, in my opinion.
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by bort »

During the brief time I had a 6/4 tuba (B&S Neptune), I really liked Geib-style mouthpieces. I had a Stofer Geib and a Kanstul Geib, both worked very well for me.

If you like stainless steel, maybe give bloke a call and get set up with one of his mouthpieces. An awful lot of people seem to like them!
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by tclements »

For a brighter sound, I like the Bobo Symphonic. For a darker sound, I use a Doug Elliott 132 rim, R cup.
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by TheGoyWonder »

I liked Bach 12 on a Conn 25J if you want a big basslike tone yet with decent definition on the front of notes.
PT-82 can help neaten it up a bit further at expense of some low-end.

Tradeoff began when you chose the 6/4 life. It can be a good choice in a very large band with other good 4/4 players to kinda play under for a lush, larger-than-life section sound.
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by TheGoyWonder »

big challenge on 6/4 is holding back. From playing 4/4 for years, you'll hear your tone and have an instinct of "i've got a lot of headroom here, increase airflow!" and then you'll use all your air at once without doing much of anything. The WOT sound of a 6/4 is not really that good anyways (maybe on premium models?? but probably just the physics of large bell openings), so you have to fight the instinct to take it to the max of of tasteful playing.
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by Rick Denney »

I use a Sellmansberger Orchestra Grand. I have in the past used a Stofer Geib and a PT-48. All of these have a Geibish shape--more cup than funnel. On my Holton 345, the Orchestra Grand opened up the low register a bit more than the Sellmansberger Symphony. I used the Symphony on my Hirsbrunner HB193 (a Bb rotary kaiser) for about a year, at which point I discovered I was ready for the Orchestra Grand. But I'm still going to get a Symphony shank for the Grand cup to see what that does.

The Stofer Geib is excellent, but I struggled with it more down low than with the Blokepieces. The PT-48 is the standard anti-woof large mouthpiece for a 6/4 tuba, but I think those others were even moreso.

For my smaller York Master, I'm still using an Elliot T cup--that mouthpiece is a bit woofy for me on the Holton.

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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by TUbajohn20J »

You definitely do not a need a huge mouthpiece for a 6/4. The horn is already big so it's going to have a huge sound regardless of what mouthpiece you use. I find that the smaller mouthpieces work very well with them. The smaller ones also help you control it better and of course help it to not sound so woofy. They get a good crisp, clean sound and response while still sounding like a 6/4 to the audience.

Conn 2XJ horns came with a Conn 2 (the small funnel mouthpiece that you can find in any old band hall today, so that's what I use on mine and I find it works VERY well. When I want a tad bigger sound or want some help with the lower range I'll use a standard Helleburg, again not a huge mouthpiece.

For smaller horns, big mouthpieces work great to compensate for the small bores. My 3/4 can produce a sound like a big 4/4 with a Helleburg or pt 42.
For bigger horns, medium size/small mouthpieces work better for (most) playing like in a community band. If you want to really crank out some pedals, sure you can switch to a big mouthpiece.
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by TUbajohn20J »

Rick Denney wrote:... The PT-48 is the standard anti-woof large mouthpiece for a 6/4 tuba...
Yes the PT-48 works great! That's my other go-to big mouthpiece for when I need that sound. A little too big for my taste for all around 6/4 use though, but definitely good to use when you need to sound like giant church organ back there.
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by Dan Schultz »

Mike Finn 3B on my Rudy 5/4 as well as everything else I play.
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by Ace »

When I bought my Cerveny 601-5MR CC tuba (a fairly large 5/4 horn) the factory provided a 24AW mouthpiece which worked rather well.

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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by GC »

My favorite mouthpiece when I had a 25J was a Warburton 32D. It was a fairly large, deep funnel cup MP. It allowed me to have a fat tone that still contained a good amount of brightness; it gave me a room-vibrating tone that wasn't too dark and woofy.
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by Uncle Markie »

I currently use a lightly modified old Wick 2L (same inside chamfer as the King 26) on my Martins. These horns are large scale instruments, but actually have bore sizes of about .720. I find it helps with articulation and control of the big horns. The core of sound produced by Martin tubas is such that you work less for the projection of sound.

Back in the circus and theme park days I never used huge mouthpieces; it wasn't until I started doing pops orchestra work after age 50 that I used a Helleberg. After the orchestra folded it was back to the smaller mouthpieces - King 26, and a Zottola 1.26A Frank modified for my use (once again, a softer inside rim which I find helps when you have to play "all day").

The Helleberg "opens up" smaller horns' sound - but if the horn is "open" to begin with, you're likely to be doing some gasping for air.

Finally - figure your own set up so that you do not "fight with the horn" - you want to play music - not struggle.

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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by barry grrr-ero »

I have three m.p's that work well on the VMI rotary Neptune (Euro shank). The best compromise of all elements, so far, is the G&W Baer IV (whatever that thing is called!). I also have a three-piece "Blokepiece", which gets a lovely sound that blends seamlessly with BBb tubas, and a Kanstul Geib. The Baer gets almost as a nice a sound as the Blokepiece, but works a bit better for me in terms of tuning, endurance, dynamic range, agility, etc. Hope this is helpful. I get compliments when I'm using the Baer.

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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by Z-Tuba Dude »

TheGoyWonder wrote:.....The WOT sound of a 6/4 is not really that good anyways....
Forgive my ignorance, but what does WOT mean?
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by happyroman »

I have done a lot of experimenting with mouthpieces over the last couple of years for my 5/4 Rudy CC and have basically settled on two or three for every day use, all of which are modeled after 1930s vintage Conn Hellebergs. They include the Cooley Helleberg, the Warburton TG4, and the Mike Finn Model H. I also have a Wedge 7B which is similar to these three in dimensions. All of these have relatively small diameters (31.5 mm to 32 mm or 1.25" to 1.26") but have deep, conical shaped cups which tends to emphasize the fundamental in the sound. I also have a couple larger mouthpieces (Laskey 28H, Wedge H2, Heavyweight, and Mike Finn MF3) if I feel I need a wider diameter cup for big contrabass tuba parts, but the first three I listed work very well for just about everything I do.
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by Erik_Sweden »

I go back and forth between different Bloke pieces and a PT-88+. Right now I use the Perantucci, but next week may be something else :)
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by Kirley »

Z-Tuba Dude wrote:
TheGoyWonder wrote:.....The WOT sound of a 6/4 is not really that good anyways....
Forgive my ignorance, but what does WOT mean?
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by PaulMaybery »

I like the Stofer-Geib (Thin wall - Great rich sound), Monette 94 (heavy wall - lots of ump), Sidey Classic Helleberg - (good clear all purpose sound)
I've also had good success with the Baer MMVI (massive sound)

Some shallower pieces like the G&W Beltane, Mirafone C4, Conn 2 help give a bit more clarity. These have less cup volume and/or also a narrower throat that I feel contributes to a bit more "user friendly" control. Wessex has a new MP for the F Tuba (Wessex F1) which I am currently using on the "Berg" but I find it also works well on the 5/4 "Wyvern" and also it worked very well on the BMB CC 6/4 BAT. There are thoughts that these shallower MPs work well on BATs. They do seem to crisp things up, but I do believe they mitigate some of the gravitas.

Large pieces I seem to think are more special purpose related and can really enhance the low end, but are not so well suited for the upper end or for being a good everyday MP. One I happen to like for that is the "Chief." Wessex has a version of that. Another is the PT 88+. The Baer MMVI might also fit that category.

What I find when using a mouthpiece with a little less cup volume on a BAT is that coming off of a huge piece, it tends to give a different impression than when, say, you spend a long practice/playging session on it. Then the smaller ones tend to open up as you begin to adjust the aperature of your embouchure and the air flow.

I think there is argument that a variety of pieces can and do work on the 6/4 tubas, some better than others. The big issue is giving the MP time for it to teach you what it needs from you.
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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by TubaSteve »

I am glad to see this post as I have been wondering what choices I may have for my Holton that Lee Stofer built for me. I have played the Holton quite a bit since I got it back from Lee, and have used it almost exclusively for the last 9 months, but have continued to struggle with the low register. The current concert we are doing had seemingly half of the ink 3 or more lines below the staff, and I have returned to my Reynolds for this concert. I love them both, but was really getting to love the Holton sound. I just need to figure out how to be able to play the lower notes without passing out. I have a mouthpiece that Lee gave me with the restoration. It may in fact be a Stofer-Geib, :oops: embarrassed to admit I don't know. I love the sound, but I don't have enough air at the bottom.

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Re: What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

Post by bort »

The problem with the Stofer Geib is that, just like the Conn Geib from which it was copied (which I used to own!), the bore of the mouthpiece is very narrow. Middle and high range sound great, but down low there's a lot more resistance and it takes a far different approach to play it with significant volume. I'm not sure if there are any real differences, but the Stofer was easier for me to play than the Conn. The Conn sounded GREAT, but it was too difficult for me to play the way I wanted to play. To a lesser extent, same thing with the Stofer.

If you like the Geib concept and want an easier low range, try the Blokepiece Symphony.
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