What mpc do YOU use on a 6/4?

[Z-Tuba Dude]

.....The WOT sound of a 6/4 is not really that good anyways....

Forgive my ignorance, but what does WOT mean?

[happyroman]

I have done a lot of experimenting with mouthpieces over the last couple of years for my 5/4 Rudy CC and have basically settled on two or three for every day use, all of which are modeled after 1930s vintage Conn Hellebergs. They include the Cooley Helleberg, the Warburton TG4, and the Mike Finn Model H. I also have a Wedge 7B which is similar to these three in dimensions. All of these have relatively small diameters (31.5 mm to 32 mm or 1.25" to 1.26") but have deep, conical shaped cups which tends to emphasize the fundamental in the sound. I also have a couple larger mouthpieces (Laskey 28H, Wedge H2, Heavyweight, and Mike Finn MF3) if I feel I need a wider diameter cup for big contrabass tuba parts, but the first three I listed work very well for just about everything I do.

[Erik_Sweden]

I go back and forth between different Bloke pieces and a PT-88+. Right now I use the Perantucci, but next week may be something else

[Kirley]

.....The WOT sound of a 6/4 is not really that good anyways....

Forgive my ignorance, but what does WOT mean?

Wide Open Throttle

It's ICE speak.

(Internal Combustion Engine)

[PaulMaybery]

I like the Stofer-Geib (Thin wall - Great rich sound), Monette 94 (heavy wall - lots of ump), Sidey Classic Helleberg - (good clear all purpose sound)
I've also had good success with the Baer MMVI (massive sound)

Some shallower pieces like the G&W Beltane, Mirafone C4, Conn 2 help give a bit more clarity. These have less cup volume and/or also a narrower throat that I feel contributes to a bit more "user friendly" control. Wessex has a new MP for the F Tuba (Wessex F1) which I am currently using on the "Berg" but I find it also works well on the 5/4 "Wyvern" and also it worked very well on the BMB CC 6/4 BAT. There are thoughts that these shallower MPs work well on BATs. They do seem to crisp things up, but I do believe they mitigate some of the gravitas.

Large pieces I seem to think are more special purpose related and can really enhance the low end, but are not so well suited for the upper end or for being a good everyday MP. One I happen to like for that is the "Chief." Wessex has a version of that. Another is the PT 88+. The Baer MMVI might also fit that category.

What I find when using a mouthpiece with a little less cup volume on a BAT is that coming off of a huge piece, it tends to give a different impression than when, say, you spend a long practice/playging session on it. Then the smaller ones tend to open up as you begin to adjust the aperature of your embouchure and the air flow.

I think there is argument that a variety of pieces can and do work on the 6/4 tubas, some better than others. The big issue is giving the MP time for it to teach you what it needs from you.

[TubaSteve]

I am glad to see this post as I have been wondering what choices I may have for my Holton that Lee Stofer built for me. I have played the Holton quite a bit since I got it back from Lee, and have used it almost exclusively for the last 9 months, but have continued to struggle with the low register. The current concert we are doing had seemingly half of the ink 3 or more lines below the staff, and I have returned to my Reynolds for this concert. I love them both, but was really getting to love the Holton sound. I just need to figure out how to be able to play the lower notes without passing out. I have a mouthpiece that Lee gave me with the restoration. It may in fact be a Stofer-Geib, embarrassed to admit I don't know. I love the sound, but I don't have enough air at the bottom.

Steve

[bort]

The problem with the Stofer Geib is that, just like the Conn Geib from which it was copied (which I used to own!), the bore of the mouthpiece is very narrow. Middle and high range sound great, but down low there's a lot more resistance and it takes a far different approach to play it with significant volume. I'm not sure if there are any real differences, but the Stofer was easier for me to play than the Conn. The Conn sounded GREAT, but it was too difficult for me to play the way I wanted to play. To a lesser extent, same thing with the Stofer.

If you like the Geib concept and want an easier low range, try the Blokepiece Symphony.

[Donn]

I just need to figure out how to be able to play the lower notes without passing out.

I just sat down and tried a handful of mouthpieces on my Holton, and couldn't really tell much difference on how much air they took on low notes, specifically. But 1) this tuba, for me anyway, doesn't have that problem in a very noticeable way (older model, different valves, but I assume pretty near the same body and "bore"), and 2) I was just playing sustained notes. I have noticed mouthpiece air problems, on whatever tuba, in faster stuff, and I'm sure that particularly applies to the low range. The particular example that stands out for me is the Marcinkiewicz H series, which has a rather large throat and must have a specially air-consuming backbore.

That said, I believe the air problems I have had with the Marcinkiewicz H in vigorous playing, are as much the fault of my technique. A mouthpiece like that may depend on the efficiency on the part of the player, that comes from better control. Luckily for me, I like the sound of my Faxx HB a little better anyway.

[TubaSteve]

Thanks for the replies! It is in fact a Stofer Geib piece. I am far from a professional, so I don't pretend that much of the problem is not my own technique. I also have asthma, but playing helps keep my lungs healthy. I do play two or more nights a week, but working 7 days a week, I don't get much time for woodshedding. (I get a couple days off a month to catch up on life needs.) One reason I have not experimented with other mouthpiece's is this is a large shank, and all my rest are standard.(maybe I should try it anyway) I would love to be able to play more confidently in the lower register with this horn. I agree with Bort's assessment about middle and high range. Once I was accustomed to the horn, these were wonderful ranges, and the horn was easy to play, and I would get a lot of compliments from the other band members on the wonderful full sound. Being a 6/4, it did take some getting used to, but I was playing my 5/4 Reynolds or my 4/4 Meinl Weston, so I have some time on large horns.

Thanks again!

Steve

[PaulMaybery]

With regard to the Stofer-Geib: Yes the throat is not as huge as on most modern MPs. At first, coming off of the larger throat models, I did feel a certain "backing up" but after a few hours of letting the MP teach me what it needs, the whole low register just opened up. The cup has considerable volume, which seems to counter the smaller throat. I have regained, I believe, all of what I had on the Monette and the PT 88+ and I find the sound is a bit richer (perhaps less coarse) and I can control the phrasing with much less effort. Will I throw away the Monette and PT? Certainly not. I can think of plenty of times when I will prefer using them. On another point (which admittedly is more subjective) I love the rim on the Stofer-Geib. It is the most seductively comfortable rim I have ever kissed

[tylerferris1213]

The Helleberg style mouthpieces have always worked for me. I use a New York Vincent Bach.

[hduong]

I use PT-50/50+ sized mouthpieces along with a Hammond 30XL.

[Donn]

The Helleberg style mouthpieces have always worked for me. I use a New York Vincent Bach.

Bach made a Helleberg style tuba mouthpiece?

[LCTuba89]

I use a medium sized Helleberg that was included with my BMB tuba. I feel it has the best balance between resistance, tone, and range. A medium sized Helleberg works the best for piston 6/4 tubas, but the large rotaries tend to be more free blowing so an F tuba mouthpiece works great at controlling them.

[apkujala]

Don't have any experience with 6/4's but I'll write anyway!

I play atm with PT-6 (rotary) and some oldish F-tuba (B&S).
On F-tuba I use nowadays Bobo Symphonic which seems to work actually quite nicely for me.

On CC I used PT-50 for long time until I decided to try find something larger to help with my low notes, mostly because the tuba I use isn't very free blowing even on PT-6 standards. Also wanted to find a heavy just to try and funzies. On my trip to test big Bb tubas (Rudy Meinl, Melton 195,196, 197 and Nirschl) I made sudden purchase of Rudy Meinl's RM 0.H, Its RM0 with big backbore and heavy model. Rim is around 33,5mm if I remember right. Now after having played it for some time I'm starting to feel it was very good purchase which will propably work very well with my Nirschl BB kaiser when it's ready.

At same time I had ordered Tilz 231-T4 and T5, 34mm and 35mm for testing. 35 was way too big as expected but 34 feels quite ok and as it has really narrow backbore and throat it changes sound on loud volumes quite much compared to the RM. I kept the T4 and can't wait to see how it works with the Kaiser.

Not saying they are the best of the best but RM at least was pleasant suprise for me. Would have ordered some Blokes also but have to wait for some cashies for that one.

[LCTuba89]

Joe, can you please explain 4 loops?

It seems the BMB is also a 4 loop design. Here I thought it was 3 but I counted the loops. I can see why the 2165 tends to be an air hog with it's 3 loop design. More loops = more resistance because of more bends in the bugle?

[southtubist]

I used to play a Miraphone 190 (massive horn!) with my Bloke Symphony with #2 medium narrow round 33.3mm rim- a pretty big mouthpiece. I tried an early Schilke Helleberg of some type, but it felt crowded on my chops. I thought I sounded ok even on the massive equipment, but it was all I had at the time, so I just made it work. It took a lot of effort to get the sound consistent across all the registers, and clear articulation was incredibly challenging. The low range was very easy despite all the other problems, as well as intonation. It sounded pretty good on the recording, though. . . I've never been one to switch mouthpieces- I think I've played the same Blokepieces for over 5 years.

Sidebar, any Miraphone 190 players have the bottom of staff F ride super sharp, with strange response?

It felt/sounded (from under the bell) that the note just "disappeared", but it sounded fine in a hall.

[adelarosa]

I've tried many, many mouthpieces (mostly due to the kind generosity of local tuba players here in Cincy) when I had the 6/4 36J/Siegfried cannon under my care.

The second best, and far and above the others trialed, was the Olka CB2. Clear sound, full projection, yet tamed the woofiness inherent in large bored beasts (I say that with the utmost respect and love for my former companion!).

The first, which I thought was always just a notch above, is a mouthpiece very similar in all respects to the CB2 but is a one-off amalgamation I'm dearly eager to test again. Hopefully one day it'll find it's way to a production model...

They being said I've been hard pressed to find a mouthpiece that better fits my musculature and playing style than the CB2. A very versatile and accommodating mouthpiece with excellent characteristics and wonderful flexibility. Highly highly recommended.

(Fwiw I've found the American shank production to differ noticably from the Euro shank version, nevermind the receiver in the intended horn. Ymmv.)