How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

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RoosterTuba
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How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by RoosterTuba »

Hello!

I recently saw a post on Facebook, and it got me wondering...

How do you all balance your practice between CC/BBb and F/Eb tuba? I've heard some people say 50/50, some say 80% of time on CC/BBb, what do YOU do?

Also, how often do you find yourself playing one in contrast to the other?

I've got the curiosity bug :D

I find myself practicing my CC tuba 70% of the time, and F 30%. I realistically am using my CC for like 90% of my gigs though. I keep the F for soloistic things, and for orchestral pieces that could use a nice F tuba.

Opinions only, and please no fighting :tuba:
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by Ulli »

At home: 33% CC, 33% Eb, 33% F Tuba
Out of home: 95% BBb, 5% CC
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by pjv »

Everyone is different and has different needs and different quirks.
I often orient my practicing towards which tuba I'll be gigging on.
If the work schedule is lean my practicing will be influenced by my mood. If I've done a lot of gigging on the one tuba then I might want to spend some more time on the other one.
Also, what's difficult to play on one tuba might be effortless on another tuba. I can use this to teach myself how to approach the other instrument. So if I've temporarily "forgotten" how to play that tuba the way it "wants" to be played, playing the same passage on another tuba can help to correct the focus of my concentration.
So for me there is no standard percentage of time spent on any instrument. It's whatever I want at that moment.
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by swillafew »

The F tuba bails me out on high register playing if I haven't logged enough time on the BBb. Play the BBb enough, and the F seems like an afterthought.

The F also fits places where the BBb won't, and this happens often during performance opportunities. (Churches, pits, riverboats, you name it).
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by hduong »

I double between CC and BBb horns in various ensembles, so I spend about 30% on each of those, the other 40% is on my F since I am playing in a few chamber groups.

realistically I play about 90-95% of my stuff on the Contrabass horns, and the rest on the F tuba. Also depends on what the conductor wants.
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by pjv »

First of all, thank you Bloke. My life will never be the same again.

So welcome y'all to post 667 (neighbour of the beast).

I don't think the F tuba is about the high register; your chops are you're chops on all instruments. I can play as high on a BBb as on a Bb tuba. And as low. F is just another instrument with a different sound. It has it's advantages and disadvantages. More transparent. More agile. Cleaner sound. It can also be lighter.

If I need a tuba to play in tight places I'll take my BBb Arion, which sports a 14" bell and has quite a "devilish" sound!
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by tclements »

I do most of my practice on contra. If I am preparing a solo, or I have a gig coming up that requires a bass, I go to more like 60/40, leaning towards F. If I am playing just for fun, I'll play F. I ALWAYS have to work on low notes (in the tritone of DEATH!), it takes very little to get my high register singing, so low notes are my 'go to' practicing.
Last edited by tclements on Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by Donn »

I guess this is not likely too relevant to the person who asked the question, nor most of the people who have responded, but for me it doesn't have anything to do with the "parts", because I don't have a "part"!

Well, I do have parts in the community band, which I play on contrabass tuba. The rest of the time, the choice depends on my musical role. The typical tuba role, holding down the bass line in back of some horns, is served best by the relatively dark and solid low end of a contrabass tuba, while my Eb tuba has a brighter tone, more present at the range of the human voice, if I'm going to be the only brass instrument and possibly taking some solo breaks. The difference is made more extreme because my main contrabass tuba is a Big American Tuba and my Eb is a little 3 valve Italian thing.
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by roweenie »

tclements wrote: the tritone of DEATH!
I feel your pain......

As for me, BB flat 6/4 for work (a.k.a. "practicing"), E flat for fun (a.k.a. "f-ing off" 《not including the "tritone of death"》)
"Even a broken clock is right twice a day".
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by Rick Denney »

bloke wrote:I don't necessarily grab the F tuba, when a tuba part sports a few "high" notes.
I more tend to grab it when a tuba part is "gymnastic", and (ok...) when tuba parts are gymnastic, they tend to go back-and-forth between low and high...I suppose...

I'm thinking I also grab the F tuba when a part doesn't sport more than one or two ledger lines below the staff, and when the ensemble is small.
Agree, with the addition that the F tuba does not increase my range, but it certainly increases my security in the upper register, at the expense of security in the lower register. In my quintet, if my music extends two low, particularly if it requires a lot of moving around down low, it's more secure on a contrabass. But I'd rather deal with issues down low than up high. If the music pops above the staff briefly, I will be missing the F if I don't have it.

But to the question asked, I have this feeling that proficiency on both instruments requires deep experience with both instruments. Bloke may not need to practice on the F as much, simply because he's put in that time in the past and his chops and fingers remember it unconsciously. I just recently felt like I was fighting the B&S and set it aside in favor of the Yamaha 621, just to see if I can figure out what's going on. I didn't have to spend more than about ten minutes on it (after several years) and everything was right where I remembered it. And the problem with the B&S is that there are still some scales that the fingers (all six of them that are required) don't remember down below the staff, and that tells me what I need to do.

There have been times when I spent 80% on F and other times when I spent 90% on Bb contrabass in my practice, depending on which gap needed filling at the time.

Rick "2 steps forward, 3 steps back" Denney
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by Rick Denney »

bloke wrote:I've played some really "winner" 621 F tubas...
I bought one-in-particular for resale a few years ago, and seriously (for about a week) considered NOT telling the client that I had found one for him. (A few years later, that same client sold that 621 and bought a more expensive "something-else" F tuba elsewhere...In my view, they moved "down" in F tuba.)
Were these available 6-valve instruments (yeah...I'm way outside the pie graph here), I might even take yet another look at one.
I've heard a few people who sound so-so on 621 F tubas, but (well...) I've also heard people sound REALLY nice on them (just as with "all other tubas").

bloke "respecting of 621 F tubas (Alexander bore...somewhat easier to play than Alex...though saying so is sacrilege), which I see as overlooked, due to being 'out-of-vogue' "
Out of vogue? Well, maybe with some. But when the Boston Brass performed with my band last year, Sam was playing a 621. Maybe not that out of vogue.

But the 621 has a ceiling above which it will not go, though that is not particularly an issue with my quintet.

Rick "thinking the 621 is more British than German" Denney
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by pjv »

THIS is how to balance the two!
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by arpthark »

Reminds me of the famous pic:

Image
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by Rick Denney »

bloke wrote:
Rick Denney wrote:...But the 621 has a ceiling above which it will not go...
I've heard/read this adage/truism often enough.
I'm skeptical of it's veracity.
Consider the two examples of users you cited in your post.
With no consideration of noteworthiness, does either of them use theirs to perform with a *large symphony orchestra?

bloke "again, pretty sure a 621-F will do (when properly asked...though, perhaps not with the most complex resonance) most anything that's needed of it - wherever it's needed"
________________________________
*the only point here being that the 621-F is rarely put to (what many consider to be) the ultimate test...so - without being tested - how can it pass?

...and no, I do not currently have one of these in my possession...so no "carnival barking" going on here :lol:
1. Yes. From a performer in a "large symphony orchestra".

2. Yes. From me. When I played stuff that should be on bass tuba in the Loudoun Symphonic Winds, the 621 sound is mostly lost. The B&S sound is not.

For small chamber groups, it's not an issue.

Rick "who has conducted the test" Denney
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Re: How to balance between Bass and Contrabass?

Post by Rick Denney »

bloke wrote:A friend of mine (plays in a full-time orch. in your state) uses a 621-F...

...puts out plenty of sound.

' has had it for not-that-long...' has had to learn to back off a bit from what "feels" like "fortissimo".
Good for him.

Rick "whose experiences are his own" Denney
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