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We all see 3/4, 4/4, 5/4, 6/4... for BBb & CC tubas but not so much on F & Eb tubas. Is there such a thing and if so what are the parameters?

No "real" parameters exist for any of those size measurements. A search of the forum would end up with many discussions on this topic regarding comparing what MW calls a size versus Miraphone, etc. Manufacturers do refer to their F tubas in such ways, though. The Electra is called a 5/4, the 2250 and 45/46s are 6/4s, the 2182 is considered a 4/4 (though their website has recently chamged it to be listed as a 6/4). Those are just some examples off of the top of my head. The 2182 is a great example of how the sizes are not set parameters as the 2182 is nowhere the same size as a 2250 or 45/46.

Editing for context as village tuba beat me to it: it's all relative to the manufacturer's "middle" tuba line.

For example, the Miraphone Petrushka is considered 5/4, as are many other Fs such as the larger B&S style horns (not good with model numbers).

There are countless examples of "Monster" 5/4 Ebs

Someone correct me, but I think MW and a couple of others make a 6/4 F (doesn't Alan Baer play one?)

Again, parameters are all internally relative with a manufacturer's line. For example, the Rudy Mienl 3/4 CC stands up to, and it even bigger than, some other similar manufacturers' 4/4 CCs.

Just for kicks, I am trying to size my horn. For an Eb it seems rather large. It is a 1938 King 1236 Symphony 4 piston (orig. recording bell) with a Monster bell (20" upright). It is a little taller than the modern 2341 @ 39"tall and just as wide. The top and bottom bows seem very similar to the 2341 also. Due to the weight of this horn I think you could make 2 modern horns! The sound is big but way more focused than my Yamaha YBB641.

For pictures please see this link.

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=65007" target="_blank

That big thing definitely qualifies as a 6/4 E-flat in my book.

My Conn Eb Monster looks like a good-sized BBb until you look at the valve set and inner wrap. There's a LOT of empty space there.




If it doesn't qualify as a 6/4 Eb, I don't know what would.

Yes, there's no standard way of measuring size throughout the tuba manufacturing community. We have large bore tubas with small bells, and small bore tubas with large bells all in 4/4, 5/4 and 6/4 tubas. I've come to realize that the girth of the bottom bow has much to do with the size and depth of sound. I like Joe's suggestion from one of the dozens of times this topic was brought up before. Fill 'em up with water and measure that way.

Fill them up with Water? An insult to my fine German tuba- Only the finest beer will do!

As for my Yamaha- only Saké will truly represent the internal volume.

I have what may well be a 6/4 E flat tuba. It is a King three-top-valve horn with about a 20 inch bell, but only stands about 31 inches high, not as tall as the one tubapix talks about. Or does that make it a 5/4? Is it a Monster? I have some pictures on my computer, but don't know how to get them onto here.

lost wrote:Technically most 6/4's we call today were 5/4 for the manufacturer's lines of tubas. There was no in between a full size horn and a larger horn.

The 6/4 designations we use today probably help us to better compare across manufacturers' horn models.

MW/Melton labels their Model 197 Kaiser tuba a "mere" 5/4 size. Other than the 6/4 Rudy Meinl, is there any other model currently under production that is bigger/taller than the so-called 5/4 Model 197 (not including custom-built/designed tubas)?

Steve Marcus wrote:

lost wrote:Technically most 6/4's we call today were 5/4 for the manufacturer's lines of tubas. There was no in between a full size horn and a larger horn.

The 6/4 designations we use today probably help us to better compare across manufacturers' horn models.

MW/Melton labels their Model 197 Kaiser tuba a "mere" 5/4 size. Other than the 6/4 Rudy Meinl, is there any other model currently under production that is bigger/taller than the so-called 5/4 Model 197 (not including custom-built/designed tubas)?

You can still order a Melton 200 Kaiser tuba... It's quite a bit bigger than the 197.

Don't see why you couldn't apply the /4 appelations to Eb or F tubas as long as you scale the size properly. I started out on a 4-valve Yammy I suspect was of average size (4/4?), went to a MW2141 (a 5/4 equivalent) and am now lugging around a Wessex Bombino, which I would comfortably put into the 3/4 category.

DonShirer wrote:Don't see why you couldn't apply the /4 appelations to Eb or F tubas as long as you scale the size properly. I started out on a 4-valve Yammy I suspect was of average size (4/4?), went to a MW2141 (a 5/4 equivalent) and am now lugging around a Wessex Bombino, which I would comfortably put into the 3/4 category.

Some manufacturers do include /4 designations for the bass tubas, but those classifications aren't always very exact. For Meinl Weston, they classify the MW 46, 2250, and the Kodiak both as 6/4, but I would designate those as 4/4, 5/4, and 6/4 respectively. There just isn't a consensus right now for size designations for bass tubas. Might be a good project for an ITEA Journal article.