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There was a small exodus of new-music-phobes during intermission....

He saw me!!

bloke wrote:Listening - for listening's sake - is much more difficult for me than listening for playing's sake.

+1

I've thoroughly enjoyed playing some pretty modern pieces that I would be less than thrilled to listen to as an audience member....

bloke wrote:
Messiaen...?? Albeit intense, I really enjoy the first fifteen minutes of most of it, can take about twenty-five minutes of the best of it, and can take about fifteen minutes of the worst of it...admittedly, about the same as with most any other talented composer's music.

...as well as anything played on a bagpipe!!

This article and Gilbert's situation are just so typical of the politics of large symphony orchestras and their conductors - especially here in America, where conductors are also expected to be in involved in administrative and fund raising duties as well.

I can't claim to know a lot about Gilbert's or New York's situation in particular. I do know that when he started, he did one of the greatest Mahler 3 performances I've ever heard. Now there's a Mahler 6 on Spotify with him and N.Y., and it's not nearly quite as good. I really like the complete Carl Nielsen symphonies he recorded in N.Y. (Dacapo label), and that may well be what his tenure is best remembered for.

https://www.amazon.com/Carl-Nielsen-Sym ... an+gilbert" target="_blank" target="_blank

Three Valves wrote:

bloke wrote:
Messiaen...?? Albeit intense, I really enjoy the first fifteen minutes of most of it, can take about twenty-five minutes of the best of it, and can take about fifteen minutes of the worst of it...admittedly, about the same as with most any other talented composer's music.

...as well as anything played on a bagpipe!!

I was just reminded this weekend, "or Greek music!!"

Fun people, great food, but more than 20 minutes of that racket and it's "pass the Ouzo" time!!

bloke wrote:...Marcello for tuba in a concert setting...?? ...not so much...UNLESS played with ONLY three valves!"

We must make it challenging!!

Did a Marcello cello sonata on a 3 valve bell front 6/4 Martin BBb on my college senior recital.

Performance groups champion programs thick with new music at the risk of losing their audience, as this article hints at.

Orchestras in Europe are often supported by the government and play whatever the music director wants them to play. AND... audiences for some well known orchestras in Europe are smaller than the number of musicians on stage. I haven't witnessed this but I have had European musicians tell me that is often the case.

My ears get bored with one new piece followed by other new pieces. They don't sound alike but they don't usually linger in the memory. With 25 years of new band music under my belt, I have played many new pieces. I would not recognize most of them if I heard them again. I would not be able to even recognize a second piece by a new composer and that's even worse. All of this leads me to believe that most of that new music was not very good.

And audiences do not want to pay to listen to not-very-good music.

bloke wrote: Messiaen...?? Albeit intense, I really enjoy the first fifteen minutes of most of it, can take about twenty-five minutes of the best of it, and can take about fifteen minutes of the worst of it...admittedly, about the same as with most any other talented composer's music.

I did a run of ten performances of Messiaen's "St. Francis" (the opera mentioned in the article). Three tuba parts, and the whole things lasts six hours with two intermissions. It's . . . taxing, both for performers and audience.