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Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby pecktime » Mon Jun 19, 2017 4:39 am

I'm looking for a bowl shaped mouthpiece that's bigger than an 18. I had a 24aw but it sucked the air out of me.

I love the sound of the 18, but it feels small and runs out of gas a bit.

Any suggestions?

There are no options locally, so I have to order online.
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby Mark Finley » Mon Jun 19, 2017 5:42 am

Bach 7 would be an option.
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby pecktime » Tue Jun 20, 2017 1:48 am

How big is the throat on a Bach 7?

If it's like a 24AW i'll pass.
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby Mark Finley » Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:24 am

It's bigger, especially on the megatone. I think I gave both versions here, I'll look
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby Bill Troiano » Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:02 am

You might want to consider a Bach 12. I played on an 18 for a while. When I went to grad school, I switched to a Bach 7 because my teacher recommended it. I played my masters recital on it, but I never felt too comfortable on it. I thought it was too big. So, after I left Eastman, I switched to a Bach 12, it being midway between a 7 and 18. I played on that for a while, until I discovered the next greatest mouthpiece. I can't even remember what that was.
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby cambrook » Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:41 am

I see you're in NZ, have you talked to Andrew Jarvis (NZSO)? I'm sure he'd have some advice and maybe some mp's to try
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby groth » Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:40 pm

How about the Perantucci line either PT-72, 82,84 OR 89? Those are all bowl shaped cups designed for the traditional German sound and all work great. (And there's a seller on the Bay who sells them for around $80) or go through Custom Tubas in Michigan for around the same price.
Last edited by groth on Wed Jun 21, 2017 12:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby bloke » Tue Jun 20, 2017 7:35 pm

Mark's suggestion - the first response, Bach 7 (...or Bach 12), is/are the obvious choice(s):
- standard design
- design related to those to which you are accustomed, but precisely within your requested parameters
- good (not bulky) rim design
- under $100
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby pecktime » Wed Jun 21, 2017 2:02 am

Thank you all! The TNFJ comes through at my time of need.
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Bowl Mouthpieces

Postby Robert Tucci » Thu Jun 22, 2017 5:21 am

Dear Pecktime,

"Bowl" is essentially apple-shaped. Tuba mouthpieces vary from this to what I will refer to as "pear-shaped". Going beyond that, one arrives at "funnel-shaped". Should you have access, the Perantucci PT-82 of recent production would be "apple-shaped", the PT-84 as well, the PT/now RT-44 less so and moving toward the fruit tree (pear-shaped). A true funnel would be the PT-83. In terms of really large tuba mouthpieces we arrive at the RT-50 and RT-88.

Off hand and to suggest just one mouthpiece, it would be the RT-44. This is available online from the Canadian Brass Store as well as from other dealers as listed on our http://www.robert-tucci.com" target="_blank web-site.

The "18" goes back a long way, a good mouthpiece without doubt but outdated as compared to the many fine mouthpieces available today.

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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby bloke » Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:04 am

:lol:
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby Donn » Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:29 am

pecktime wrote:How big is the throat on a Bach 7?

If it's like a 24AW i'll pass.


According to David Werden's chart, it's 8.33 mm, where the 24AW - and the 18 - are 8.84 mm.

Bach's own mouthpiece publication, or at least the copy I found here, gives all three of them their No. 810 backbore, and maybe the same 8.84 throat - depending on how you interpret this (anyone's guess, I'd say)
bachthroat.jpg
bachthroat.jpg (21.89 KiB) Viewed 1291 times


It will be interesting to hear where Mark's actual examples fit in. Looks like the 12 has the 8.33 mm throat, anyway.
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby bloke » Thu Jun 22, 2017 2:04 pm

Do I believe that Bach 12 or 7 mouthpieces are "the world's most amazing mouthpieces" ?
~no~
Do I believe that both are sensibly-designed production "bowl"-style mouthpieces that work ?
~yes~
Am I astonished and in-great-admiration-of a tuba player anytime I observe a tuba player doing well with a *24AW ?
~yes~
______________________________________
*24AW:
- small mouth opening: less space for the lips to vibrate and send a frequency into the instrument
- extremely wide rim: pins down the face, and restricts flexibility
- huge throat: lacking resistance, which taxes the player much more in the "control" department
...and yes, I HAVE heard some players make very nice sounds with these mouthpieces, but (again) I'm in great admiration of them for being able to do so.
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby Donn » Thu Jun 22, 2017 5:08 pm

I've never tried one, but why bother - the 24AW, outdated.

Hmm ... yesterday I was having a lot of fun playing on a mouthpiece that was outdated a long time ago, to the extent of hasn't been available for like 80 years, who knows. But my tuba is 76 years old, so maybe it's a good thing, as long as we all get outdated together.
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby barry grrr-ero » Fri Jun 23, 2017 3:45 am

The 3+1 Besson 'eefers' sound beautiful with a 24AW. John Fletcher used it frequently in the Philip Jones Brass Ensemble. I heard Tommy Johnson say that it was intended for Eb tubas.

I've never tried a Bach 12, but would be curious to do so. All that said, you could hardly get better m.p. input than from Robert Tucci. We're so very fortunate to have him chiming in on Tubenet. Joe "Bloke" Sellmansberger is a huge help as well.

I'm currently using the Stofer Geib on my Neptune and I'm very happy with that combination. It's almost a bowl shape - perhaps more 'pear like' as Mr. Tucci describes. It has a relatively small throat that works well with the Neptune (keeps it from being an 'air hog' AND gets a nice sound).

I describe the Stofer Geib as being a cross between the old Miraphone C2 and C3 mouthpieces, if that means anything to anybody (two m.p.'s from my past).

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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby Three Valves » Fri Jun 23, 2017 7:58 am

barry grrr-ero wrote:
I've never tried a Bach 12...


I haven't even seen one!!
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby bloke » Fri Jun 23, 2017 8:17 am

Bach 25 is a "small bowl cup mouthpiece".

Bach 22 is a "medium bowl cup mouthpiece".

Bach 18 is a "medium large bowl cup mouthpiece".

Bach 12 is a "large bowl cup mouthpiece".

Bach 7 is a "very large bowl cup mouthpiece".

Bach 24AW (in my view) is a "bizarre bowl cup mouthpiece".

Anything larger than a 7 (debatably, and regardless of cup style) might best be considered for a special purpose or for a particular instrument to accomplish a particular goal.
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby Three Valves » Fri Jun 23, 2017 8:30 am

My problem, among several, :roll: is that when I had a PT-44, a Bach18 and a 24AW, my lips and my tuba in the same room, the wife in the next room would say, "are you playing that other (non 24AW) mouthpiece again??" :evil: Even though the others felt better, the 24AW sounded better.

One day, I was shoving beer coozies under my electric bass guitar strings to get the sound I was looking for. She chimes in, "That sounds just like a string bass!!"

And that's why I keep her!! 8)
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby bloke » Fri Jun 23, 2017 9:32 am

If the extra-narrow bowl cup and extra-large throat seem to work for you, you might consider having the rim shaved down and the mouthpiece re-plated.
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Re: Bowl Mouthpiece help

Postby Three Valves » Fri Jun 23, 2017 9:49 am

bloke wrote:If the extra-narrow bowl cup and extra-large throat seem to work for you, you might consider having the rim shaved down and the mouthpiece re-plated.


Are you talking about my wife or the 24AW?? :shock:
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