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I'm looking for a bowl shaped mouthpiece that's bigger than an 18. I had a 24aw but it sucked the air out of me.

I love the sound of the 18, but it feels small and runs out of gas a bit.

Any suggestions?

There are no options locally, so I have to order online.

How big is the throat on a Bach 7?

If it's like a 24AW i'll pass.

You might want to consider a Bach 12. I played on an 18 for a while. When I went to grad school, I switched to a Bach 7 because my teacher recommended it. I played my masters recital on it, but I never felt too comfortable on it. I thought it was too big. So, after I left Eastman, I switched to a Bach 12, it being midway between a 7 and 18. I played on that for a while, until I discovered the next greatest mouthpiece. I can't even remember what that was.

I see you're in NZ, have you talked to Andrew Jarvis (NZSO)? I'm sure he'd have some advice and maybe some mp's to try

How about the Perantucci line either PT-72, 82,84 OR 89? Those are all bowl shaped cups designed for the traditional German sound and all work great. (And there's a seller on the Bay who sells them for around $80) or go through Custom Tubas in Michigan for around the same price.

Thank you all! The TNFJ comes through at my time of need.

Dear Pecktime,

"Bowl" is essentially apple-shaped. Tuba mouthpieces vary from this to what I will refer to as "pear-shaped". Going beyond that, one arrives at "funnel-shaped". Should you have access, the Perantucci PT-82 of recent production would be "apple-shaped", the PT-84 as well, the PT/now RT-44 less so and moving toward the fruit tree (pear-shaped). A true funnel would be the PT-83. In terms of really large tuba mouthpieces we arrive at the RT-50 and RT-88.

Off hand and to suggest just one mouthpiece, it would be the RT-44. This is available online from the Canadian Brass Store as well as from other dealers as listed on our http://www.robert-tucci.com" target="_blank" target="_blank web-site.

The "18" goes back a long way, a good mouthpiece without doubt but outdated as compared to the many fine mouthpieces available today.

Bob Tucci
Munich

pecktime wrote:How big is the throat on a Bach 7?

If it's like a 24AW i'll pass.

According to David Werden's chart, it's 8.33 mm, where the 24AW - and the 18 - are 8.84 mm.

Bach's own mouthpiece publication, or at least the copy I found here, gives all three of them their No. 810 backbore, and maybe the same 8.84 throat - depending on how you interpret this (anyone's guess, I'd say) It will be interesting to hear where Mark's actual examples fit in. Looks like the 12 has the 8.33 mm throat, anyway.

I've never tried one, but why bother - the 24AW, outdated.

Hmm ... yesterday I was having a lot of fun playing on a mouthpiece that was outdated a long time ago, to the extent of hasn't been available for like 80 years, who knows. But my tuba is 76 years old, so maybe it's a good thing, as long as we all get outdated together.

The 3+1 Besson 'eefers' sound beautiful with a 24AW. John Fletcher used it frequently in the Philip Jones Brass Ensemble. I heard Tommy Johnson say that it was intended for Eb tubas.

I've never tried a Bach 12, but would be curious to do so. All that said, you could hardly get better m.p. input than from Robert Tucci. We're so very fortunate to have him chiming in on Tubenet. Joe "Bloke" Sellmansberger is a huge help as well.

I'm currently using the Stofer Geib on my Neptune and I'm very happy with that combination. It's almost a bowl shape - perhaps more 'pear like' as Mr. Tucci describes. It has a relatively small throat that works well with the Neptune (keeps it from being an 'air hog' AND gets a nice sound).

I describe the Stofer Geib as being a cross between the old Miraphone C2 and C3 mouthpieces, if that means anything to anybody (two m.p.'s from my past).

Barry Guerrero

barry grrr-ero wrote:
I've never tried a Bach 12...

I haven't even seen one!!

My problem, among several, is that when I had a PT-44, a Bach18 and a 24AW, my lips and my tuba in the same room, the wife in the next room would say, "are you playing that other (non 24AW) mouthpiece again??" Even though the others felt better, the 24AW sounded better.

One day, I was shoving beer coozies under my electric bass guitar strings to get the sound I was looking for. She chimes in, "That sounds just like a string bass!!"

And that's why I keep her!!

bloke wrote:If the extra-narrow bowl cup and extra-large throat seem to work for you, you might consider having the rim shaved down and the mouthpiece re-plated.

Are you talking about my wife or the 24AW??

When I've been playing a mouthpiece for a few months, that's the one that probably sounds the best to a listener. The more unusual the mouthpiece, the more I expect that would be true.

Another part of it could be, I wonder, if maybe many players would sound better to a listener with a smaller cup diameter mouthpiece. Like a Schilke 66, or a Conn 7B, or the even smaller 24AW (OK, that's from published measurements, which we know are not a good basis for comparison.) For fun lately I've been trying out an antique Conn Giant on my Big American Holton, which despite the name is probably closer to a Bach 25 in diameter - but with a pretty large throat.

For anyone who's been wondering, how could I measure my Bach mouthpiece throat to help resolve the questions posed above - if you have a decent collection of "twist" drill bits, the larger 8.83mm throat should just barely pass an 11/32 bit, but you'll have to go down to 5/16 with the smaller 8.33 throat. Correct me if I got that wrong. Hold the cutting edge and put the bit in shank first.

bloke wrote:whatever applies

I guess she COULD use a little "work!!"

I think he was using them to measure only, not drill.

I had the same issue with the 18 - it was not deep enough. I then got a Dillon Geib 5. It is a smaller than the PT-88 I used a few years ago. I was hesitant about the back bore because "The G5 has a 7.5 mm throat. The throat is C4 sized." from: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=36609 .But it is working for me. I have read on the forum about the Geib mouthpieces and am trying it on my Mirafone 186 with pretty good results.

That's more or less what I was thinking when I suggested that the bit be introduced into the throat shank first, holding the cutting edges. I assume the shank is exactly the nominal size of the bit. But you know, most of the time a mouthpiece could use a little cleanup, gunk in the throat, and as long as you don't really lean on it, maybe a good thing.

I'm not the only one who ever uses drill bits as a mouthpiece throat gauge, am I? I am sure I didn't come up with the idea on my own. Seems to me some people use other sizes, not metric but some kind of letter gauge - suit yourself of course, but I like the explicitly dimensioned bit sizes, because simple person that I am, if I am trying to determine the size of a mouthpiece throat, and the answer is "P", that means I now just have another question. Where if the answer is 11/32 it's just arithmetic, multiply by 25.4 for mm.

Don't let us forget though, this is not one of those ridiculous tangents all, we're waiting with bated breath for Bach 7, 18 and 12 owners to report actual throat dimensions.

Interesting. Assuming those are "throat" dimensions (which I understand to be different from "back-bore"? Their brochure says No. 810 backbore for the full size mouthpieces) ... it doesn't do much to dispel the confusion from Bach's brochure, inasmuch as it's still ambiguous on the dimensions of (say) a Bach 18 you'd find on the shelf at a music store.

Is it the "standard for Bach"? Is it the dimension that you list as "available", brochure says "Special" but also "Standard"? Likely the latter - the .348 throat on the 18 as well as 24AW, as listed on David Werden's chart - but there's that ambiguous language and the popular impression that the 24AW has a large throat, not the same throat and backbore as the 18.

bloke wrote:
....and having Mrs. bloke judge what sounded best with arrays of models of tubas..."

Ahh-haaa! So Mrs. Bloke is the actual inventress of these! I hope she gets the money!
royjohn