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When you say "lengthen the #3 compensating slide" ... this is the additional tubing that's part of the 4th valve circuit? Does it really have a slide, or would that be a customization?

Not the common #3 valve tubing (which might also be maybe a hair flat for B/F#/etc.)

It seems like a good idea to me.

also if you can get 3rd long enough to use 1-3 and still have 2-3, you can put 4th longer (until 2-4 is too flat). i guess you gotta really looking for maximum length to do that.

What about a kicker on the 1st, 3rd or 4th slide?

bloke wrote:topic: 3+1 (or the 983 system...whatever) compensating tubas and tuning
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LENGTHEN the #3 compensating slide

It is kind of common practice to have this compensating slide way out.
On my Besson, it is as far out as possible without falling apart.
I remember Mr. Tuba mentioning lengthening it to BBb tuba - size for some customers.

So, seems like a good idea...

oedipoes wrote:

bloke wrote:topic: 3+1 (or the 983 system...whatever) compensating tubas and tuning
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LENGTHEN the #3 compensating slide

It is kind of common practice to have this compensating slide way out.
On my Besson, it is as far out as possible without falling apart.
I remember Mr. Tuba mentioning lengthening it to BBb tuba - size for some customers.

So, seems like a good idea...

Yep, mine has some string to stop me blowing it out as it's all the way out

I like it.

I concur....Mine is pulled out as far as it can go without falling off.

kk

Never played Eb (unfortunately)
But
What's with the ridiculously long 3rdV slides?
Seems like a lot of (unnecessary?) extra metal.
Or is it to tune the 3rdV down another 1/2 step?

I have already done this on the Wessex Eb tubas, extending the 3rd compensating slide by 2cm (0.8") each leg and adding pull ring. That was one of the first improvements I made.

     If that's what you did with the Bombino, Jonathan, it seems to work.

DonShirer wrote:     If that's what you did with the Bombino, Jonathan, it seems to work.

Yes, it was also done with the Bombino and Excelsior BBb

I had one of those 'stop thingees' put on the 3rd valve compensating slide, just so that I could pull it waaay out w/o the worry of it falling on to the floor. This was back when I had a Besson 3+1 eefer.

I'm going to say, quite categorically, that 5 valve systems are STUPID on Eb and F instruments, UNLESS you make the 5th valve a tri-tone valve (like on the older Gronitz Eb), or a 'quint valve' (lowering the horn a full perfect fifth). I say this as someone who played the compensating system for several decades and found few problems with it.

This may be an obvious question, but can the Eb 3rd comp loop slide now be put in the BBb second valve loop with no real loss of functionality? Other than the recent "mystery solved" thread, i have not heard of tuba players pulling the 2nd valve slide much as a general rule.

Anyway, i am looking forward to perhaps generate my own practial experiences to contribute to this thread...

I did consider adding more than 2cm, but then players that are used to lipping complain of the tuba playing flat. 2cm longer slide enables 4cm longer overall pull so will solve problem without the slides being dangerously near to falling out.

bloke wrote:The thing is this:
Euphoniums need this as well.

I personally do not find this problem with Wessex Dolce euphonium, but am open to being told otherwise by real euphonium players

It's been a bit since I last tooted one the newer German made Besson Ebs so I no longer recall the details with certainty BUT if I recall correctly some idiot decided to lengthen the 4th valve so that it is flatter than it ought to be. This put the low E-natural perfectly in tune but everything above it was an abomination.

That same horn, ALSO had a peculiar receiver design. Rather an a smooth transition into the leadpipe there was a large drop off into markedly larger diameter tubing. This marked drop just happened to coincide with where the end of a typical mouthpiece shank would rest, effectively doubling the affect.

Also, from the factory the valve alignment is a mile off.

I truly have no understanding, other than tradition and dogged determination to sound great no matter what, why these horns enjoy any success at all.

bloke wrote: Perhaps (??) Wessex-specific comments could be transcribed into a new thread entitled something such as
"Wessex instruments: perfection, utopian wonderland, transcendence, and the Shangri-la of Brass"...

WHAT! All I did was reply to your comment

Have you got the hump because Wessex addressed this issue before your beloved 'high-grade' Packer???

bloke wrote:

humBell wrote:This may be an obvious question, but can the Eb 3rd comp loop slide now be put in the BBb second valve loop with no real loss of functionality? Other than the recent "mystery solved" thread, i have not heard of tuba players pulling the 2nd valve slide much as a general rule.

Anyway, i am looking forward to perhaps generate my own practial experiences to contribute to this thread...

' prolly...if you own two same-make instruments that also have the same crooks/geometry.
Of course, there would then be a significant bore gap in the #2 front-side slide on the BBb.

Will check said geometry when i next have them in the same room. May be a while...
They are same make give or take the variations in ownership that happened in 30-40 years preceeding wwii.

I thought of gap, but personally i would try, and switch back and forth as i cared.
I have occasionally been guilty of this behavior with sousaphone necks as well...

I have a Wessex Solo and would love to know when this 3rd valve compensating slide extension was done as it could still benefit from added length. Or I should say, I have a Wessex custom, which I was told is the same as the Solo I ordered (only after I received it). I think it is poor practice to sell something to someone that is different then advertised. If I bought a GMC Sierra 1500 and received a Chevy Silverado- they call that bait and switch.
I paid the same new price and when I questioned this I did not so much as receive an apology, only told," they are the same."

Eflatdoubler wrote:I have a Wessex Solo and would love to know when this 3rd valve compensating slide extension was done as it could still benefit from added length. Or I should say, I have a Wessex custom, which I was told is the same as the Solo I ordered (only after I received it). I think it is poor practice to sell something to someone that is different then advertised. If I bought a GMC Sierra 1500 and received a Chevy Silverado- they call that bait and switch.
I paid the same new price and when I questioned this I did not so much as receive an apology, only told," they are the same."

If your Wessex Solo does not have the lengthened slide then it was manufactured before that improvement was implemented. Like the phone you buy now will have improvements over what was sold last year, so may be the case with a Wessex instrument. We are always working to improve and make them better. The Custom on the bell is irrelevant. That was just version of Wessex engraving used for a while - it means nothing particular.

If you require longer slide then contact me off-line. I am sure we can get made.