Brass Band Tuba Music Bookmark and Share

The bulk of the musical talk

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby hup_d_dup » Tue Oct 17, 2017 2:58 pm

Sam Gnagey wrote:
Salient advantages to players include easily reading tenor clef and tuba players gaining proficiency in playing E-flat tuba in bass clef.



And yet another advantage is that players will have proper sight-reading skills in treble clef when the band is evaluating new music.

Hup
hup_d_dup
4 valves
4 valves
 
Posts: 528
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2011 10:10 am
Location: Tewksbury, NJ

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby imperialbari » Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:07 pm

Sam, it looks like the board listened to you. Good!

Klaus
User avatar
imperialbari
6 valves
6 valves
 
Posts: 7364
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2004 4:47 am
Location: Duets by Mozart, Beethoven, Rossini, and Weyse. Soli by Saint-Saëns, Massenet, Elgar, and Nielsen.

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby Voisi1ev » Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:03 pm

I've been playing in a group since like March. I started with a Bb horn my school owns for the rest of the spring then learned to play the Bb treble parts on my 52J over the summer, since it is a nicer horn.

Not too bad. Starting to read stuff pretty well. I'm better off sounding better on this horn I think.

I agree all those transposition rules mess me up, I just learned the fingering.

And playing in brass band is awesome. I missed it from college brass band, but we all cheated then and had bass clef parts from finale.
User avatar
Voisi1ev
bugler
bugler
 
Posts: 60
Joined: Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:43 am
Location: Michigan

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby Voisi1ev » Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:59 pm

What I forgot, are there any good treble BBb methods? I haven't looked much. Easy to find state side?
User avatar
Voisi1ev
bugler
bugler
 
Posts: 60
Joined: Fri Jul 03, 2015 11:43 am
Location: Michigan

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby imperialbari » Tue Oct 17, 2017 11:04 pm

There used to be a series of British tutor books for all kinds of brass instruments, some of them like the low brasses coming in treble clef as awell as in bass clef. I have the one for bass trombone in G, but I am not sure where it is right now, so I can’t tell you the editor.

With the older brass band literature your needs for range development would be well covered by the cornet/trumpet version of Arban. The modern repertory goes higher and especially lower.

My free download project has scale- and interval systems that take treble clef (and bass clef) reading low brasses with the sufficient number of valves quite high and low for a 4 octave range. My (very long term) project of creating 2nd parts for the Blazhevich etudes also works with very wide ranges. As does some of the tuba parts for my various arrangements for smaller and larger ensembles.

Give me an email address and I will invite you to the project.

You will find the address for the index in my signature. My parts and etudes directed towards valved low brasses usually come in variants in bass clef concert as well as in treble clef BBb & Eb. This also goes for my recent setting of an early 19th century quick step where the 3 lower parts have some funny passages that take good reading skills, also in the very low version for 4 BBb tubas.

Klaus
User avatar
imperialbari
6 valves
6 valves
 
Posts: 7364
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2004 4:47 am
Location: Duets by Mozart, Beethoven, Rossini, and Weyse. Soli by Saint-Saëns, Massenet, Elgar, and Nielsen.

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby Dan Schultz » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:53 am

Sam Gnagey wrote:Here's an email that I, as personnel manager, sent out to the low brass in the Old Crown Brass Band. The group has placed 3rd in NABBA 3rd section for the last two years:

The following policy was adopted by the OCBB board last night by unanimous vote:

Providing routine transpositions of treble to bass clef parts will cease as of the first of the year, 2018. The librarian will offer method books to those players who lack the proficiency to read treble clef to help them learn the skill. There remains yet two concerts in the current year where those bass clef parts will be available. For the December 22 concert parallel treble and bass clef parts will be available for those members to also help with their learning process. This will give those involved nearly three months from now for mastery of reading treble clef parts.


This policy removes the onerous and time consuming task from those kind members of the band who have done it in the past.
It will serve to eliminate errors in transposed parts that cause wasted time and frustration in rehearsals.
The process of transposition usually produces parts with twice the number of pages without well positioned page turns causing difficulty in playing those parts..
Treble clef parts do not have so many notes on many leger lines above the staff (tbns, bari, euph) and below the staff ( BBb tuba) making them easier to read.
The board believes that reading treble clef is just part of the true experience of playing in a British brass band.
It is generally accepted that this skill is pretty easily acquired in two to three weeks of somewhat regular practice.
While not advisable, members are not prohibited from making their own transposed parts, however other members are discouraged from doing this for them.
Any beginning trumpet method book will serve in learning this skill. I recommend Getchell's books 1 and 2.
Salient advantages to players include easily reading tenor clef and tuba players gaining proficiency in playing E-flat tuba in bass clef.

Please contact me or any board member if you have any questions about this new policy.
Sam


That's just wonderful, Sam. Rather that to go through the rigors of a motion to your Band Board and such... it would have made much more sense to just tell the person who doesn't want to provide bass clef transpositions that he/she just doesn't have to do it any more and to pitch the person who insisted on the bass clef transpositions out on his/her ear. That's all that's happened here, anyway. Maybe the next step should be to simply ban bass clef transpositions from your band. After all... they DO sound different, don't they? Perhaps you need to also approach the judges at NABBA to ban any bass clef transposition from the stands on stage at their competitions.

A little forward thinking wouldn't hurt. ... at least until the millions of educators in The World start teaching treble clef exclusively. Maybe if the traditionalists would have had their way back in the 1800's... we'd still be playing ophecleides.

Back to my original post... there's absolutely NO reason why publishers cannot offer bass clef options. I totally understand their reluctance when engraved plates are concerned but in this modern age of digital publishing... there's just no excuse except for bull-headness and tradition.
Dan Schultz
"The Village Tinker"
http://thevillagetinker.com" target="_blank" target="_blank
Current 'stable'... Rudolf Meinl 5/4, Bohm & Meinl helicon, Marzan BBb 'slant-rotor', King 2341, Alphorn, BBb cimbasso, etc.
User avatar
Dan Schultz
TubaTinker
TubaTinker
 
Posts: 10070
Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 11:46 pm
Location: Newburgh, Indiana

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby Sam Gnagey » Wed Oct 18, 2017 11:37 am

Voisi1ev wrote:I've been playing in a group since like March. I started with a Bb horn my school owns for the rest of the spring then learned to play the Bb treble parts on my 52J over the summer, since it is a nicer horn.

Not too bad. Starting to read stuff pretty well. I'm better off sounding better on this horn I think.

I agree all those transposition rules mess me up, I just learned the fingering.

And playing in brass band is awesome. I missed it from college brass band, but we all cheated then and had bass clef parts from finale.


You may not realize that you're learning to play F tuba by reading the BBb treble parts on a CC tuba. When you get an F tuba in your hands you'll be quite proficient. The fingerings will work out nearly perfectly with the reading skill you're gaining right now.
Sam Gnagey
TubeNet Sponsor
TubeNet Sponsor
 
Posts: 513
Joined: Sun Mar 21, 2004 10:09 am
Location: Columbia City, Indiana

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby Sam Gnagey » Wed Oct 18, 2017 12:22 pm

Perhaps I should have chosen the words in my original reply more carefully. Those words were not intended to reflect directly on any of my colleagues on this board. However, in general, I do feel sorry for musicians who are too busy or lacking in desire to acquire greater technique or reading skills.

Right now our 3rd section band is way out of our depth playing Arnold's Fantasy for Brass Band preparing for a performance this Sunday. I've had to shed the hell out of it as well as all of our members. It's gratifying to see the enthusiasm that the band has shown in taking on the challenge of a championship (1974) level composition. Our upcoming performance certainly wouldn't place in the running in any championship level competition, but the experience has set the band up for jumping up a section when it comes time for competition next April.

Attempting the Arnold like learning to play treble clef demonstrates that we only improve when faced with a challenge to try and master.
Sam Gnagey
TubeNet Sponsor
TubeNet Sponsor
 
Posts: 513
Joined: Sun Mar 21, 2004 10:09 am
Location: Columbia City, Indiana

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby Eupher6 » Sat Oct 28, 2017 3:52 pm

Kinda surprised at this looooong thread.

I was even more surprised when I started playing tuba (well, okay, DOUBLING on tuba) in 2009, about 41 years after I started playing trombone and euph, and bought Roger Bobo's book, "Mastering the Tuba." Somewhere around page 8, interspersed with the English, French, and German text, he has the beginning student -- (that would be me) playing tuba in treble clef.

WTF?

But then it occurred to me that it lays the ground work for playing EEb tuba, and since Roger has based himself in Switzerland for some years now, and for brass banders.

Being primarily a euph player, I can say with total sincerity that playing in British style brass bands is the total bomb. Nothing else remotely like it, save perhaps for smaller chamber ensembles where there is no place to hide.
U.S. Army, Retired
Adams E2 Euph (on the way)
Boosey & Co. Imperial Euph, built 1941
Bach Strad 42O tenor trombone
Edwards B454 bass trombone
Kanstul 33T tuba in BBb
User avatar
Eupher6
pro musician
pro musician
 
Posts: 114
Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2006 12:46 pm
Location: Mississippi Delta

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby TWScott283 » Thu Nov 02, 2017 8:43 pm

Learn the transposition. It's not that hard. Might take a month to get really comfortable.

The medium is worth it.
TWScott283
bugler
bugler
 
Posts: 59
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:35 am
Location: Haslett, MI

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby mikebmiller » Fri Nov 03, 2017 4:32 pm

I mostly play trombone and own a euph that hasn't been played in a year or so, but I would love to play in a brass band if there was one close to me. The closest is about an hour and a half drive. Would someone explain to me why all the parts in brass band are in treble clef? Do tuba/euph players in the UK not play in orchestras or wind bands with bass clef parts? Is a difference in the music education system in the UK? Is music taught by the brass bands rather than by the schools? I am just curious as to how the tradition of low brass players having to read treble clef parts developed. It seems like in the US, there are two types of euph players - those that used to play trombone and those that used to play trumpet and switched to euph in junior high because they got braces. The former trombone players only read bass and the former trumpet players only read treble. Even the 70 year old guy in my community band has never bothered to learn to read bass clef. And I don't know any tuba players that can read treble clef. Admittedly, I live in a medium sized town and play in a very average community band, so I don't have exposure to a plethora of tuba players.

Just curious. Thanks.
mikebmiller
lurker
lurker
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2016 4:08 pm

Re: Brass Band Tuba Music

Postby Dan Schultz » Fri Nov 03, 2017 7:40 pm

mikebmiller wrote:..... Would someone explain to me why all the parts in brass band are in treble clef? Do tuba/euph players in the UK not play in orchestras or wind bands with bass clef parts? .....


There have been some good points made here already. However... the ONLY reason for the folks who publish brass band to refuse to provide bass clef parts is tradition.
Dan Schultz
"The Village Tinker"
http://thevillagetinker.com" target="_blank" target="_blank
Current 'stable'... Rudolf Meinl 5/4, Bohm & Meinl helicon, Marzan BBb 'slant-rotor', King 2341, Alphorn, BBb cimbasso, etc.
User avatar
Dan Schultz
TubaTinker
TubaTinker
 
Posts: 10070
Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 11:46 pm
Location: Newburgh, Indiana

Previous

Return to TubeNet

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Chuck W, fwtuba, Google Adsense [Bot], TheGoyWonder and 34 guests