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Re: How many "orginal" York CC tubas we have now? ;)

Postby GC » Thu Feb 08, 2018 2:20 pm

Jim Self's website has a picture of a 4/4 York CC that was restored by Lee Stofer. If my memory is correct, it belonged to the session player who played the Flintstones soundtracks. It's a gorgeous instrument.

http://www.bassethoundmusic.com/hardware.html about halfway down on the left.
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Re: How many "orginal" York CC tubas we have now? ;)

Postby YORK-aholic » Thu Feb 08, 2018 3:43 pm

Oldschooltuba wrote:
york.jpg
It is my understanding that York made about 12 CC tubas. So with these two and the CSO horns, that leave 8 others.


I have also heard that there were roughly 10-12 CCs made, but it was in reference to the 4/4 sized model 692 (the one on the right in your picture). The Rusk cut one on the left almost certainly started life as a 6/4 BBb, likely with 3 top action valves and can't be counted in that number.
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Re: How many "orginal" York CC tubas we have now? ;)

Postby lost » Thu Feb 08, 2018 3:58 pm

Yes....the thread was about "original" and not modified and cut up york horns with new valvesets.
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Re: How many "orginal" York CC tubas we have now? ;)

Postby besson900 » Thu Feb 08, 2018 5:25 pm

On Baltimorebrass.net is for sale York F tuba model (last one on page)
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Re: How many "orginal" York CC tubas we have now? ;)

Postby Tom » Thu Feb 08, 2018 5:37 pm

besson900 wrote:On Baltimorebrass.net is for sale York F tuba model (last one on page)


Baltimore Brass Website Says wrote:A used York 5V F tuba assembled using York bell/bows and a King valve section. Features a removable leadpipe and 5th valve. Has cosmetic wear and some plating loss on the valves. Requires a strong ear for intonation. Classic York sound! Used, no case


This is not a factory built York tuba or even originally an F tuba. It is actually a "custom" tuba or a "cut" tuba. That distinction has been explained pretty clearly in this thread, I think. You cannot call this an "original" York.

the elephant wrote:You are confusing York tubas that have been cut to a new key by someone else. In THAT case there are many York tubas out there, including 6/4 horns, that were built in Bb or Eb that others cut to C or F decades later. Such tubas are not York products. They use York parts along with parts from other tubas (in most cases) to create a new tuba that sounds like the original but that use a much more modern valve section set up (four front-facing pistons and a rotary valve for 5th with a slide that lowers the pitch by a flat whole step).

Many of these horns are terrible because the person who cut them did something wrong. It is *very* difficult to successfully cut a horn to play in a new key. Some of them are very decent tubas, though, and usually net a very high price.
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Re: How many "orginal" York CC tubas we have now? ;)

Postby toobagrowl » Fri Feb 09, 2018 12:38 am

GC wrote:Jim Self's website has a picture of a 4/4 York CC that was restored by Lee Stofer. If my memory is correct, it belonged to the session player who played the Flintstones soundtracks. It's a gorgeous instrument.

http://www.bassethoundmusic.com/hardware.html" target="_blank" target="_blank about halfway down on the left.


I think the previous player was George Boujie (sp?). If I remember correctly, I read an article years ago where Mr. Self stated that he played the 4/4 York CC on the 1990's movie "Dennis the Menace". He stated that it is quite a 'lively' tuba. You can hear tuba throughout that movie :!: :tuba:
Last edited by toobagrowl on Fri Feb 09, 2018 9:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How many "orginal" York CC tubas we have now? ;)

Postby Oldschooltuba » Fri Feb 09, 2018 7:35 am

the elephant wrote:You are confusing York tubas that have been cut to a new key by someone else. In THAT case there are many York tubas out there, including 6/4 horns, that were built in Bb or Eb that others cut to C or F decades later. Such tubas are not York products. They use York parts along with parts from other tubas (in most cases) to create a new tuba that sounds like the original but that use a much more modern valve section set up (four front-facing pistons and a rotary valve for 5th with a slide that lowers the pitch by a flat whole step).
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[/quote]


Elephant's description of my horn is spot on. However, Bob Rusk did a great job on this one. Playing it side by side with other Yorks, its sound is spot on. Intonation is very very good. It is a very responsive clear sounding 6/4 mostly York tuba. Not bad for a horn that is around 95 years old.
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Re: How many "original" York CC tubas do we have now?

Postby windshieldbug » Sat Feb 10, 2018 10:46 am

In the Simonetti tuba collection there is a horn marked "York and Sons" which is in F and BBb (a full double tuba). Since the valves are purpose-built, if not York, someone went to a LOT of trouble to build a York in F...

https://simonettitubacollection.com/ins ... uble-tuba/
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Re: How many "orginal" York CC tubas we have now? ;)

Postby the elephant » Sat Feb 10, 2018 10:56 am

the elephant wrote:You are confusing York tubas that have been cut to a new key by someone else. In THAT case there are many York tubas out there, including 6/4 horns, that were built in Bb or Eb that others cut to C or F decades later. Such tubas are not York products. They use York parts along with parts from other tubas (in most cases) to create a new tuba that sounds like the original but that use a much more modern valve section set up (four front-facing pistons and a rotary valve for 5th with a slide that lowers the pitch by a flat whole step).


Oldschooltuba wrote:Elephant's description of my horn is spot on. However, Bob Rusk did a great job on this one. Playing it side by side with other Yorks, its sound is spot on. Intonation is very very good. It is a very responsive clear sounding 6/4 mostly York tuba. Not bad for a horn that is around 95 years old.


My Rusk-cut Holton 345 also plays very well, with some flaws. I have been hard at work to correct his terrible workmanship so that it better reflects his excellent engineering. Hopefully the tuba will be as fantastic as it *could* be once I have finished correcting some horrors hidden under the silver plate he put on it. ;-)
Last edited by the elephant on Sun Feb 11, 2018 9:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How many "original" York CC tubas do we have now?

Postby the elephant » Sat Feb 10, 2018 11:00 am

windshieldbug wrote:In the Simonetti tuba collection there is a horn marked "York and Sons" which is in F and BBb (a full double tuba). Since the valves are purpose-built, if not York, someone went to a LOT of trouble to build a York in F...

https://simonettitubacollection.com/ins ... uble-tuba/" target="_blank" target="_blank


Since the Germans have the tradition of BBb and F with F being the primary horn and BBb the "extra" one, it could be that York filled a special order for a German who came to the US and could not find an F he liked. At the time that "York and Sons" was the marque I think BBb/F double tubas existed in Europe. It is hard to tell with such custom horns, since they do not appear in catalogs and sometimes there is little or no record of them having been made in the first place. So I could imagine this tuba being 100% York while still saying that York did not sell F tubas.

It could also be a very old FrankenTuba... 8)
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Re: How many "original" York CC tubas do we have now?

Postby bloke » Sat Feb 10, 2018 12:10 pm

As far as "cut" C tubas are concerned, I've played a couple of very successful 4/4 (originally: 3V top-action) York instruments that were flipped around and fit with King 1241 valvesets. Not too much ends up really being "cut", as the King dogleg articulates really well with the smaller York upper bow. The 5th partial (E, Eb) was pretty friggin' flat on both of those tubas, but - other than that - they were playable and "real purdy"-sounding.

============================================================================
extremely off topic: The 4/4 Buescher Bb tubas from the 1920's make significantly better C tubas than Bb's, and require no cutting of the bows...but I've stated this here way too many times in the past.
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Re: How many "original" York CC tubas do we have now?

Postby happyroman » Sun Feb 11, 2018 6:11 pm

In this video interview with Bob Rusk, he said that he was aware of 12 York CC tubas that were made, and knew the whereabouts of six of them. As we all know, Bob was famous not only as an excellent tubist with the Milwaukee Symphony for 25 years, but he also took York BBb tubas and cut them down to CC (as well as cutting Eb to F). During this time, he became quite an expert on York tubas, so this info is probably as good as one can find.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TE6E2Ne_D5k
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