Tuba review. Visit to FMB in Gütersloh

[pjv]

This week I took a visit to FMB in Gütersloh to look at BBb and F tubas. This is the list of tubas I played;

BBb
GR51
Piggy 603
Kaiser 691
Bohemia 684-4G
Fafner 195
Fasolt 196
Hagen 495 gold
Hagen 496
Hagen 497
And for kicks
Coolwind plastic tuba (couldn't resist the silver)
their Cerveny helicon

F
Aria 3
Harmonia 3
Concordia 851-6 gold
45S-LP
2182
2260
4250
4450
Electra
Berg
621

They have many more tubas then listed here, these are just the ones I tried out.

I went about it rather systematically, playing every tuba for about 5-10min in order to decide if I would play on it later that day. Once my selection was made I concentrated on the tuba individually then did a back-on-back "audition" with every tuba and recorded it.
I concentrated on the BBb's, checking from the 12th p down to halfway through the 2nd p.
With the time I had left I played on the F's.

--BBb tubas-
In general I was very pleased to note that the quality of tubas has improved. The intonation is more consistent, the valves are quicker and quieter and they all played very open throughout all registers. Unfortunately ALL the BBb's I've tried were 4 bangers.


ALEXANDER
Because I was at the factory recently I'll add their 163 & 164 to the bunch.
The Alex' played very easy and responsive. Unfortunately the intonation was what I call old school; low 5th partial, almost unmovable. As well the valve response wasn't what I'd expect from a modern tuba, even if it is in a showroom model. Not snappy enough.
-163-outside of the 5th p great intonation top to bottom. A real joy to play.
-164-but when you play the 164 it almost makes you wonder if the 163 really wishes it was this tuba, because the sound is just so much more tuba to enjoy. But, oh well, then came the old school intonation, not only on the 5th p but also on the 3rd p. Sorry Alexander.

B&S
-GR51-This is the second one I've tried out. Lovely even sound. Good valves Not enough bite for my taste.

CERVENY
I only really knew the older heavier versions. Their modern-day tubas were one of the pleasant surprises this day. They are light weight tubas and have, in my opinion, the same kind of feel I get from an Alex; with little effort you get large results. Dark sound and very flexible. All had much quicker and quieter valves than I expected (more so than the GR51). These tubas are a definite must for players with back problems. Try before you buy.
-Piggy 603-Fun tuba. I wasn't happy with intonation difference between the 3rd and 4th p.
-Kaiser 691-very easy player. I felt that this particular tuba may not have been the best one built. Something felt not right but it was subtle. (or maybe just how I was trying to play it?)
-Bohemia 684-4G- I'm not looking for a 4/4 tuba but if I was this might have been a winner. I couldn't put it down. Everything was easy and it still retained a nice deep voice. And it sat comfortable on my body. They only had it with a gold brass bell.
-helicon-it was OK. I recently played another one a month ago and that one was better; the response was more like a tuba and a very easy blow. This one felt like something wasn't 100%

COOLWIND
--tuba with four vales-- Surprise surprise. This sounded like a tuba. Nice body, great intonation. Pity about the valves making so much noise. Maybe when I'm 95 I'll buy one cause these were super light.

MELTON, Fafner 195 and Fasolt 196. Old school tuning (as in low 5th p) and sluggish valves. Wasn't worth the effort. Nice sound and I liked the ergonomics. Sorry Melton.

MIRAPHONE
Super valves, so quick I had to step up my game to keep up. And the tubas also respond very quickly. Strangely enough, even though these tubas are heavy mama's, they respond much in the same way as the Alex, Cerveny lightweight tubas. With very little effort you can achieve the maximum results. So playing Prok. Romeo & Julliet became real easy and joyful to play, if only because I could play longer phrases in one breath.
-Hagen 495- They only had this with the gold bell. It wasn't what I was looking for so I didn't spend much time with it. Nice horn.
-Hagen 496-Great tuba. If it had 5 valves I might have taken home. Who knows. It's listed as being a 496A, so I assume that Miraphone is warming us up for a 496B.
-Hagen 497-also a really great tuba. More lovely sound but a tad less quick out of the starting block (in my hands) Also listed as a 497A.

One thing I can't figure out about German tubas; the mouth pipes that first go up then back down. Condense builds up in the moth pipe and just sits there, waiting to escape through the mouthpiece. Every time I even lean a bit to the right I get dumped on. You'd think someone would have dealt with this a century ago.


--F tubas-

ALEXANDER Again, I was recently at their factory so I'm adding my 2 cents to this list. They had a bunch of them and they all had that old school funky C.
Except the old Bohemian model in the stairwell. Someone should examine that horn more closely 'cause the C rocked.
Or it was the stairwell.

B&S, with the presence of seven models models they get an honorable mention. I already own a lovely 70's Symphonie. With the time limits that I had I decided not to try these out. Decisions, decisions.

CERVENY Again, what a surprise. Good intonation and no problems in the low register. The all sported a 2nd valve trigger. The 2nd valve would need to be vented in order to work properly.
-Aria 3-smaller than what I am looking for. Not bad at all.
-Harmonia 3-sounded a bit more mature than the Aria. On the other hand, the bell is farther away from the ears than on the Aria which in this case translates to a bit rounder sound. Still, a bit too small for what I want.
-Concordia 851 gold-they only had it in a gold brass bell. This should have been their top model but intonation was off=low 5th p. Plus I couldn't seem to tune one of the lowest 4 notes in the 2nd p (I don't remember if that was A, Ab, G or Gb). Sorry Cerveny.

MELTON
-2182-fun little tuba which sat nicely in the lap. Would've been even funner if there had been 6 valves or a slide tuning device somewhere. The lower 2nd p register wasn't tunable. Can't remember if it was the G or the F# (probably the G)
-2260-I'm trying to figure out why this tuba was made with 2 dependent valves. Upper register wasn't easy. I gave up on it.
-4250-ladies and gentlemen, we have a winner! The only tuba I wanted to walk out with and that didn't need (in my opinion) any additions or tweaks. And as it turns out it was the most expensive instrument I'd played on, with the exception of the Hagen 497.
Nice even sound, nice even intonation. With only 5 valves Melton solves their low register intonation problems with probably the best 2nd valve slide trigger out on the market. Quick, easy and sturdy.
-4450-My first impression was that this was a 4250 with a larger bell. At least that's the way it played. Since this for me was not an improvement I stopped any further research and went back to playing the 4250. Oh well.
-45S-LP-Many of the things that were right about the 4250 were wrong on the 45. Intonation was a bit off and even with the 2nd valve slide trigger adjusted to the maximum I couldn't get the 2nd p G low enough. The trigger itself was slow and unstable making it practically useless. The 5th valve itself was wack. It was a real long throwing rod behind the tuba with some weird adjustment thingy in the middle. Unstable and NOISY. About a half year ago I played on a used 45 which didn't have these problems (except for the low G that is), so either that particular tuba was "tuned-up" or the new ones have been "improved" haha. Disappointing since I was expecting a better 45 than the afore mentioned used tuba.

MIRAPHONE Very unfortunate that they only had one model available, and in several different versions (silver, gold, 6 valves etc etc)
-Electra-Probably a real great tuba. Valves were great, intonation also, but the sound was much thinner in than what I am looking for.

WESSEX
-Berg- Will wonders never cease. This tuba is exactly what everyone has been saying it is; big sounding tuba with spot on intonation. No triggers and only 5 valves. OK, I liked the 4450 sound better but let's not forget the Wessex is less than 1/4th the price of a Melton. Chapeau Wessex. Down side was that the valves were rather noisy. Having said that I didn't check to see if they needed adjusting or not. My Wessex cimbasso has normal quiet valves.

YAMAHA
-621- Always wanted to try one. Nice fit, easy playing. Great low register. Unfortunately old school intonation (low 5th p, high 2nd p G). A tuning trigger or a 6th valve would've been nice. Yamaha should bring this tuba up to speed with the competition. The sound and the model itself are attractive enough to justify an improvement. Sorry Yamaha.

[pjv]

and sorry for the long post. Keeping it short is not one of my talents.

[PMeuph]

FMB...?

Fachmarkt Blasinstrumente

Specialist market for brass instrument.

[MikeMason]

I had a 100$ main tuning slide rod added to my new yfb621. Problem solved. Anyone who might be interested,I’ll take some pics.

[pjv]

If you ask me tuning rods are becoming a thing of the past. There are enough top quality tubas out there that play in tune to choose from. As long as we keep demanding this from the manufacturers and rejecting “intonationally challenged” tubas, things can only get better.

[bort]

"Old school tuning" is a pretty awesome description.

Thanks for the reviews!

I know you didn't try any... but do they have many CC tubas there?

[pjv]

Not much. 5 St. Pete's and 2 B&S (GR 41-L and 4097/L).
Thomann is even worse with one CC, a Melton 3450.
Both companies "carry" everything but what's in stock is another matter of course.
https://www.fmb-direkt.de/en" target="_blank
click on the flag in the upper right hand corner for English. once you selected the instrument type your looking for (tuba, CC) make sure to click on the filter button for "immediate delivery". That'll tell you what's immediatly available.