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It is ironic that Bloke should be the author of this thread about "dressing down." When a person really looks into the history of the tuxedo, one will find it was the original semi-formal dress down from tails and starch collars in the late 1800's.

What next? For summer gigs, one community group I play in wears logo polos and black trousers. Another local group already has gone to matching logo t-shirts (yes, t-shirts, not polos) and jeans for their community performances.

I am the stick-in-the-mud. I prefer the tuxedo as the Duke of Windsor wore it: peak lapels, vest or cummerbund, single satin stripe trousers, tie-your-own-tie, and - most importantly - a pleated shirt with a TURN-DOWN REGULAR COLLAR. These stupid triangle wing collars that are part of the shirt and are not true detachable hard-starch collars are the worst bane to formal wear ever, even lower than a "Western" brown tuxedo, or the powder blue with ruffles of the '70's.

So yes, I will continue to wear my tuxedo proudly to gigs that call for it, including recent weddings and social events. I have it tailored properly, including an extra inch in the waist so I can breathe properly while I play. Even if I sit next to bloke in his t-shirt and jeans.

dgpretzel wrote:... I also prefer that the women wear black gowns or even pants, and don't show bear legs or arms. ...

Oooo. You touch on a sore subject with a college ensemble I play with. Concert attire for men is conventional black suit, white shirt, black long tie. Attire for the ladies is black dress or black pantsuit. Unfortunately, too many of the women interpret that as "little black dress" - or it's the only black in their closet - and as you can guess there have been issues vis-a-vis sitting on a stage. The past couple of years the director had to be specific about "below the knee, please" after getting nastygrams from offended concert attendees.

I like concert dress of just black trousers (pants to you Americans) and shirt (black, white, or agreed uniform color) without tie. Much more comfortable to play!

dgpretzel wrote: don't show bear legs or arms.

This issue is likely much more common in Alaska.

Just don’t show up in bare feet, please!!

Mike C855B wrote:

dgpretzel wrote:... I also prefer that the women wear black gowns or even pants, and don't show bear legs or arms. ...

Oooo. You touch on a sore subject with a college ensemble I play with. Concert attire for men is conventional black suit, white shirt, black long tie. Attire for the ladies is black dress or black pantsuit. Unfortunately, too many of the women interpret that as "little black dress" - or it's the only black in their closet - and as you can guess there have been issues vis-a-vis sitting on a stage. The past couple of years the director had to be specific about "below the knee, please" after getting nastygrams from offended concert attendees.

I've seen this come up a lot with younger players, too. In college, our non-major ensemble had simple concert guidance of "all black." One young lady determined that a mostly-sheer black top, fur-trimmed vest, short skirt, fishnet stockings, and 4" heels fit the definition just fine. The group's adherence to a professional standard took priority over its need for an 8th flautist. The stage manager had a pointed conversation with her, and she did not perform that evening.

fenne1ca wrote:
I've seen this come up a lot with younger players, too. In college, our non-major ensemble had simple concert guidance of "all black." One young lady determined that a mostly-sheer black top, fur-trimmed vest, short skirt, fishnet stockings, and 4" heels fit the definition just fine. The group's adherence to a professional standard took priority over its need for an 8th flautist. The stage manager had a pointed conversation with her, and she did not perform that evening.

By “not perform” you mean she didn’t play the flute??

My concert wear when jacket is required is usually a tuxedo. The tux was purchased used from a tux shop. The Bill Blass jacket was probably only rented once, and the pants had never been rented (un-hemmed). The cost was less than any suit that I could buy, and the pants were hemmed for free. Total out the door was around $75.

I can also use the tux (since it has a more modern lapel than my last suit) on formal nights when I'm on a cruse.

Yes, you can get a cheap tux from JC Penny when they have their annual suit sale. I HAD to get a tux for a particular short term cruise gig. Specified “not suit” in the contract. Awful. Uncomfortable. Hot. And I looked like the ship’s waiters.

Short of that, for regular jobs, local civic groups etc anyone not granting me health benefits, which is where I pretty much draw the line on any directive,...but I guess I’d have to bow and wear a tux for a symphony job, but I think iverpe played my last one. One weekend on tenor tuba or utility trombone, I think I can get by.

For regular Joe gigs, Invest in a high quality black suit, wool blend at least or summer weight wool, that feel like pajamas but wear and look like a high quality tux. High quality shirt and shoes. Tie your own tie bow tie,or straight. And commerbund if and only if necessary. In short, dress like an adult professional. And you can go decades with no question or comment except from the trombone players. And they have no pull or say.

It is just not worth being uncomfortable in a cheap or even mid range tux. And a suit can be worn forever. Gosh as a tuba player, someone is gonna die before their time. Maybe me. Again, ultimate suit wins.

And I’m done with bands that wear polos. I don’t work for Bennigan’s.
I just wear a dress shirt in a similar color, sans bandie emblem, and refer to my health benefits requirement. You can take my community band dues but not my self respect.

I just subbed and played October fest with a band that wore matching t shirts. Uggh. I wore short sleeve dress shirt and a smart tribley. Patrons bought who a beer? The guy dressed like an adult.

BrassedOn wrote:And I’m done with bands that wear polos. I don’t work for Bennigan’s.

I don't know who's Bennigan, but I can't see myself in a polo shirt. Maybe because I have never worn one. I dropped out of a band that I had just started rehearsing with, when it developed that the polo shirt was the uniform for a gig that was coming up. (I also seem to remember something about Santa Claus hats, but I think that was a little farther off.) The polo shirt was a sort of weird grey color that leaned towards blue-green but somehow managed to have some pink in it too, like they'd gotten a batch that was made with whatever dyes were left over at the end of the day.

Though a page or two ago I proposed the turtleneck, I have to admit that was not entirely genuine. I've done it, but I'm not crazy about them.

Cheap? CHEAP? Come on, guys: get a real one. A deal is one thing, like the good deal mentioned above, but get a real one out of real wool. No poly. No blends. Have it tailored properly. Watch your weight over the years and make sure the trousers have enough extra material in the waist. It should last over 20 years for those of us mere mortals who play occasionally, and at least a decade for those who play more often. This is an investment over time, like the tuba is. We pay how many thousands of dollars for tubas, cases and accessories, but won't spring for a few hundred for a real tuxedo when required to play it? Come on....

iiipopes wrote:Cheap? CHEAP? Come on, guys: get a real one. A deal is one thing, like the good deal mentioned above, but get a real one out of real wool. No poly. No blends. Have it tailored properly. Watch your weight over the years and make sure the trousers have enough extra material in the waist. It should last over 20 years for those of us mere mortals who play occasionally, and at least a decade for those who play more often. This is an investment over time, like the tuba is. We pay how many thousands of dollars for tubas, cases and accessories, but won't spring for a few hundred for a real tuxedo when required to play it? Come on....

I might just be clumsy, but between band directoring and tuba carrying I end up going through a stupid number of tuxedos so I started buying cheap ones. Just random tares and scratches from loading/unloading/hitching up trailers and such.

BrassedOn wrote:I’m done with bands that wear polos. I don’t work for Bennigan’s.
I just wear a dress shirt in a similar color, sans bandie emblem, and refer to my health benefits requirement. You can take my community band dues but not my self respect.

I just subbed and played October fest with a band that wore matching t shirts. Uggh. I wore short sleeve dress shirt and a smart tribley. Patrons bought who a beer? The guy dressed like an adult.

Funny, but I have the exact opposite feeling about short sleeve dress shirts. When I see them, I think of young boys dressing for Easter and McDonald's managers. Give me the polo....as lomg as it doesn't have wide horizontal stripes.

We should simply just start wearing these: https://goo.gl/v24YNw .

It would be far more professional.

Sorry, but it looks like that isn't wool.

Best uniform I ever wore was when I played with the “Be Natural Jazz Band” - black bow tie and towel! (We played at several Naturalist resorts in California.)

Was it "good naked" or "bad naked?"

Donn wrote:

BrassedOn wrote:And I’m done with bands that wear polos. I don’t work for Bennigan’s.

I don't know who's Bennigan, but I can't see myself in a polo shirt.

Bennigan's was the early 1990s precursor to Applebee's and Chili's restaurants. In the movie "Office Space" (a modern classic IMHO), Jennifer Anniston works in what is basically a Bennigan's, for which she wears a polo, suspenders, and just the required amount of "flair". Classic!

That's what I feel when someone asks me to play music in something dopey.

bloke wrote:btw...Cummerbunds are supposed to be worn with the folds pointing upward, not downward. Many online pictures of them (for sale) display them upside-down, as photographers and website creators do not know this.

Hence, "crumb-catchers" for cummerbunds.

David Richoux wrote:Best uniform I ever wore was when I played with the “Be Natural Jazz Band” - black bow tie and towel! (We played at several Naturalist resorts in California.)

'

I hear the band really swung.