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Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 12:41 am
by tizzdizz
Hi,
I am looking for something that seems to be just what Wessex has in this horn, size, features, price etc. However this appears to be a new horn, released this year? So I can't find any reviews, opinions, or videos of it. I can't even seem to find photos other than those on their website. Has anyone tried one of these, perhaps at a trade show, etc? Any idea where they fit on the ladder?
https://wessex-tubas.com/collections/bb ... agon-tb484" target="_blank" target="_blank
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 9:08 am
by BrassedOn
And,
What is the extra cylindar near the leadpipe? Is that a spring for a master tuner, and is related to the tuning rod above the 3rd valve?
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 9:44 am
by pittbassdaddy
The Dragon looks like a 4 valve version of the Viverna. I'm sure that Steve Marcus could likely provide better info.
There is a short vid on youtube of the Viverna. I believe that I played the Viverna briefly at the Cleveland Tuba Day back in May, but it didn't leave an impression like their 6/4 models did.
BrassedOn wrote:And,
What is the extra cylindar near the leadpipe? Is that a spring for a master tuner, and is related to the tuning rod above the 3rd valve?
The extra tubing there looks like a creative way to come up with a good place to mount the thumb ring on a valve set that does not have the down turn in the first valve tubing like what is seen on King tubas. Similar tubing also looks to be present on the Viverna, Grand, and Wyvern (CC) tubas.
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Mon Oct 15, 2018 6:28 pm
by Three Valves
Or a flower...
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:49 am
by Steve Marcus
The Wessex Dragon, with its 4 piston valves, has had limited distribution to those who preordered it. More are expected in January.
Meanwhile, the 5-rotary valve Viverna is being upgraded to the Wessex High-Grade Series. More details to follow...
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:40 pm
by Davidus1
Steve Marcus wrote:The Wessex Dragon, with its 4 piston valves, has had limited distribution to those who preordered it. More are expected in January.
Meanwhile, the 5-rotary valve Viverna is being upgraded to the Wessex High-Grade Series. More details to follow...
All rotary valves? Or 4 piston one rotor? Just curious because I've only seen the piston horn listed on the website. Thanks for posting!
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 2:09 pm
by Steve Marcus
Thanks for pointing this out, Davidus1.
The TB480 Viverna has 4 pistons and one rotor. The TB575 Luzern has 5 rotors. The TB484 has 4 pistons. All are BBb.
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 3:11 pm
by GC
@Steve,
Do all three share the same post-tuning slide bows and bell? Is the only difference between the Viverna and the Dragon the 5th valve? Are there any monster Eb project pictures available?
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 3:37 pm
by Steve Marcus
GC wrote:Do all three share the same post-tuning slide bows and bell?
In their initial design (primarily by Chuck Nickles), the Dragon and Viverna have the same 19” bell and slide bows (the 5th valve on the Viverna is 0.850” bore). Both models feature pistons that are positioned so that smaller players (read: school students) as well as full-sized adults can manipulate them comfortably.
The Luzern has an 18” bell and a 0.77” bore while the other two BBb’s have a graduated bore in the first 4 valves from 0.748”-0.790”.
Is the only difference between the Viverna and the Dragon the 5th valve?
The Dragon was indeed based upon the current Viverna without the 5th valve. But the next shipment of Vivernas will be as HIgh-Grade tubas (more about that designation to follow).
Are there any monster Eb project pictures available?
Nothing that you haven’t already seen. However, on a related subject, I recently purchased a Conn 28K Eb sousaphone for Wessex in consideration of its bell on a future Eb horn (not necessarily to be a forward bell). There are some higher priorities on the new Wessex model horizon right now, but the monster Eb project is not being ignored for the future.
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 3:59 pm
by GC
Thanks for all the details. Haven't seen any pictures of the Eb project, though.
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 7:12 pm
by bububassboner
If you search through the “frankentuba” page on Facebook you’ll see one picture of the monster Eb I built that will be the starting point of this project.
On to the dragon,
There are a few differences between the four valve dragon and the five valve Viverna. The dragon will only come with a yellow brass bell while the Viverna will have the option of gold brass bell. The dragon comes only with four valve while the Viverna has five valves and they are vented valves. The Viverna will now be made in the high grade department (same people as the Chicagos) while the dragon will be one step down from there.
Both do have the extra fourth valve pull that the grand has. So you (or your young students) can grab a fourth valve slide inside the horn rather than reaching over for the normal fourth valve pull. I shifted things closer to the bell so the horn doesn’t want to lean to the players left.
I’m quite happy with this horn. By using some pre-existing bell and larger branches I was able to make a tuba that’ll be a great addition to any high school band for a very nice price (if I remember correctly under $3,000 but Steve would know better). I just bought a house on land and will be building a parts Storage facility there so we can keep a LARGE amount of parts on hand at all times here so we should be able to ship out parts much faster than most. Give the tuba a try at the next show.
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 8:04 pm
by GC
Thanks for the additional info.
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 12:55 am
by Wyvern
There are currently very limited Dragon out in the wild with most of first batch not passing Wessex quality assurance at factory. We don’t want any tubas going out that are not up to standard.
[quote="GC"]Thanks for all the details. Haven't seen any pictures of the Eb project, though.[/quote]
The monster Eb is just waiting in line to be developed in 2019. There will be pictures of the production tuba, once prototype is made. This is one I am excited about playing myself, so hopefully won’t be too long!
The next new tubas on their way from Wessex are a 6-valve rotary F, a British compensated F tuba and 3/4 front piston BBb tuba. Those should all be a Midwest Conference together with the new Kaiser BBb which got consistent compliments during my European tour with even the prototype being bought by a German professional!
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 2:22 am
by Cthuba
Wyvern wrote:There are currently very limited Dragon out in the wild with most of first batch not passing Wessex quality assurance at factory. We don’t want any tubas going out that are not up to standard.
GC wrote:Thanks for all the details. Haven't seen any pictures of the Eb project, though.
The monster Eb is just waiting in line to be developed in 2019. There will be pictures of the production tuba, once prototype is made. This is one I am excited about playing myself, so hopefully won’t be too long!
The next new tubas on their way from Wessex are a 6-valve rotary F, a British compensated F tuba and 3/4 front piston BBb tuba. Those should all be a Midwest Conference together with the new Kaiser BBb which got consistent compliments during my European tour with even the prototype being bought by a German professional!
British compensating f is really an exciting development that could rock the f tuva world. My friend Rick Benjamin has an excellent example with a trigger he made for the 3rd valve. Excellent instrument.
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:33 pm
by Davidus1
[quote="Steve Marcus"]
The Dragon was indeed based upon the current Viverna without the 5th valve. But the next shipment of Vivernas will be as HIgh-Grade tubas (more about that designation to follow).
Does this mean a price increase on the BBb Viverna??
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 4:35 pm
by Steve Marcus
Davidus1 wrote:Steve Marcus wrote:...the next shipment of Vivernas will be as HIgh-Grade tubas.
Does this mean a price increase on the BBb Viverna??
Very possibly. However, the current published price for the Viverna will be honored for those who preorder a TB480H High-Grade Viverna with a 25% refundable deposit by October 31, 2018.
Since the Wessex web page does not currently have an option for preordering a Viverna, a phone call to (616) 843-6888 enables a secure credit card deposit to reserve your TB480H for delivery in January/February 2019.
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 11:28 pm
by Davidus1
Steve Marcus wrote:Davidus1 wrote:Steve Marcus wrote:...the next shipment of Vivernas will be as HIgh-Grade tubas.
Does this mean a price increase on the BBb Viverna??
Very possibly. However, the current published price for the Viverna will be honored for those who preorder a TB480H High-Grade Viverna with a 25% refundable deposit by October 31, 2018.
Since the Wessex web page does not currently have an option for preordering a Viverna, a phone call to (616) 843-6888 enables a secure credit card deposit to reserve your TB480H for delivery in January/February 2019.
Thanks Steve! Great info.
Re: Any experience with Wessex Dragon TB484?
Posted: Sat Oct 20, 2018 12:09 am
by Steve Marcus
Steve Marcus wrote:GC wrote:Do all three share the same post-tuning slide bows and bell?
In their initial design (primarily by Chuck Nickles), the Dragon and Viverna have the same 19” bell and bows (the 5th valve on the Viverna is 0.850” bore). Both models feature pistons that are positioned so that smaller players (read: school students) as well as full-sized adults can manipulate them comfortably.
The Luzern has an 18” bell and a 0.77” bore while the other two BBb’s have a graduated bore in the first 4 valves from 0.748”-0.790”.
Is the only difference between the Viverna and the Dragon the 5th valve?
The Dragon was indeed based upon the current Viverna without the 5th valve. But the next shipment of Vivernas will be as HIgh-Grade tubas (more about that designation to follow).
Are there any monster Eb project pictures available?
Nothing that you haven’t already seen. However, on a related subject, I recently purchased a Conn 28K Eb sousaphone for Wessex in consideration of its bell on a future Eb horn (not necessarily to be a forward bell). There are some higher priorities on the new Wessex model horizon right now, but the monster Eb project is not being ignored for the future.