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From roughly 1984-88 I was playing in an non-serious adult band with regular marching performances. Since the only tuba I had at the time was the 28J, I strapped it on and went with the flow. Used a lyre, too, since the playlist was too large to memorize. Between the flipbook and the horn, let's just say vision was compromised.

Would I do it now? With the Conn, why not, but I certainly wouldn't risk my good concert horn.

Bell-front Kings were popular in many areas in the '70's and are still around here and there. They sound great on the field and are easier on the body than contras (and often lighter).

In Europe a majority of marching bands use concert tubas.
In Germany also Kaiser tubas.
Myself I've never used anything else.
Other used basses are helicons and sousaphones but these are not common.

In the 60's some CA universities were using Miraphones. If you count Besson/B&H EEb &BBb tubas many are still used in UK, Aus. and elsewhere.

British Army has largely stopped marching with larger BBb but will still use Besson 982 EEb's for ceremonial etc. Trade off of sound quality vs risk of chronic occupational back injury!

Sousaphones. Sousaphones. Sousaphones.
Why bother with all the crap, dis-ease of holding, strange postures, the pull on the player's back (why the UK stopped marching with BBb) inconsistent projection, and all the other B*******?
Sousaphones. Sousaphones. Sousaphones.

In the Canadian Military Bands, which I direct a Reserve Army Band (infantry), the standard is marching with concert tubas.

In the reg force, our full time, almost all players play Eb's of some variety, usually a Besson Comp, but they have their choice of instruments. In the reserves, part-time, the players uses what the reserve band has, some times their standard horn or a extra 3/4 size. Almost all reservists have full time jobs separate from music, so getting the tuba player to commit to learning Eb for the 5 or 6 standing/marching gigs we do a year is not feasible.

In my experience talking to a lot of the tuba players they end up with back issues, in my network of members I know there are 4 that have been medically discharged as tuba players. Now that I am an officer, I will be trying to at least improve the situation in the band I direct. I have started looking into the harnesses that are available, as well as the smallest lightest horns that can try to project on concert. My other main issue is I rarely have more than one tuba player, and if they are a monster player they get recruited to the Reg Force.

Every bell-forward tuba (excluding oddballs) had a sousaphone of the same brand which is pretty equivalent. The bells even interchange. So why wouldn't you just go straight for the sousaphone??
If you had to do it, old rotary tubas at least weight less.

Most schools in my area (from middle school to college) use sousaphones for marching. But there are a few who use convertibles or contras for marching. Convertible tubas and contras are basically 'concert tubas in marching form'.

We used sousaphones for marching and concert band in my high school, and they sounded great on the field and in the auditorium. Also used sousas for marching band at my first college.

Sousaphones just (imo) work the best for marching band and strolling gigs. Overall best sound and ergonomics for such use

iiipopes wrote:Sousaphones. Sousaphones. Sousaphones.
Why bother with all the crap, dis-ease of holding, strange postures, the pull on the player's back (why the UK stopped marching with BBb) inconsistent projection, and all the other B*******?
Sousaphones. Sousaphones. Sousaphones.

I love the sound and response of a good sousaphone; I don't love the back rearrangement I received in 2011 from playing one in a long parade.

My freshman year in HS (1978-79) I marched with a 20J. Great sound and we almost converted it to a contra style horn (It can be done!). The next director wanted sousaphones and I marched with the same Reynolds brushed silver horn until I graduated. I also used it occasionally in concert band and once in the school orchestra as Santa Clause!

I guess this sort of undermines the old idea that the precise contours of the leadpipe is a major determinant of the tuba's playing character. I mean, if sousaphones are just as good as equivalent lap tubas, and considering how their leadpipes are pieced together out of junk.

I've marched, loosely speaking, with a lap tuba. Much harder with top valves - that was for a while my primary incentive to stick to front valves, so that I could "march" (i.e., walk) with it if necessary. Recording bell is not necessary - helicons are fine marching instruments and don't point forward - and a straight bell is easier to carry.

KiltieTuba wrote:Oh look... we're off-topic discussing sousaphones in relation to a topic on concert tubas in a marching setting... in six posts...

Sometimes things just happen slowly...……….

^ Not only that, but how can you NOT talk about sousaphones when discussing marching band, at least here in the US Then you get into "marching", and you can talk about the real-deal drill/formations on-field 'marching', or military/ceremonial/parade marching-down-the-street-in-straight-lines 'marching'

I honestly don't think I've seen actual 'concert tubas' used in marching situations. Besides sousaphones, contras and convertible tubas, there was ONE band I saw using Cerveny BBb helicons for marching band many years ago during H.S. competitions. It was actually kinda cool seeing a band using those "weird" rotary helicons, while everyone else was using sousas and contras.

Although.... in my opinion....... concert tubas offer a nice warm bottom to a marching band, off the top of my head, I can think of at least three issues with using tubas instead of sousaphones. 1. Tubas are somewhat cumbersome to handle on the move...... especially if you are in a show-style marching band..... quick turns in opposite directions, high step, sudden stops, etc. In corps, and in a straight ahead parade band, it's a totally different ballgame. 2. In marching bands, I like the more pronounced (for lack of a better description) brighter and intense sound. While some huge bands have been designed to offer a concert band sound on a football field, I prefer to have my attention (and ears) commanded by the sound of an impressive "outdoor" sounding band.... Example..... Ohio State. 3. I regard concert tubas as prized instruments. Therefore, I'd be knocked to my knees to see the damage that occurs to marching band sousaphones, happen to my concert tubas!!

You can add the Italian bersaglieri military bands. Top valves. The music isn't very complex, and they don't really march - they sprint. But they do it in synch and in formation, so I think it counts. Other Italian marching bands also use top valve tubas. Portuguese bands use whatever they can get their hands on, top or front valves - and the tubas march in front.

bloke wrote:
rather than than resting them on a left shoulder MUSCLE (which is typically sore for three or four days, and then becomes strong).

One of my High School section mates called it "da juice bone"

. . . and if you're assuming he wasn't particularly bright, he was the valedictorian of his class

bloke wrote:

k001k47 wrote:

bloke wrote:
rather than than resting them on a left shoulder MUSCLE (which is typically sore for three or four days, and then becomes strong).

One of my High School section mates called it "da juice bone"

. . . and if you're assuming he wasn't particularly bright, he was the valedictorian of his class

TOPIC: "da juice bone"
What did he mean by that. Simply, I'm not "getting" it...?? (P.M. or post the explanation, please.)

beats me . . . it's just what he called that group of muscles and tendons. Three of the top 10 students in that class were tubaists, now that I'm thinking about it.

I've marched with my B&H Imperial a couple of times without straps or support. Not impossible on a short gig, but I really prefer a sousaphone.

I've never played an actual marching tuba or a convertible. Do they have a specially shaped outer pipe, or how does one hold a marching tuba still? I tried holding a concert tuba on my shoulder and it felt very impractical and unstable.

Lars Trawen wrote:In Europe a majority of marching bands use concert tubas.
In Germany also Kaiser tubas.
Myself I've never used anything else.
Other used basses are helicons and sousaphones but these are not common.

I also have a feeling that Central European bands quite often use concert tubas. Helicons are sometimes seen.

Is sousaphone too American for them?

bloke wrote:

KiltieTuba wrote:Oh look... we're off-topic discussing sousaphones in relation to a topic on concert tubas in a marching setting... in six posts...

not really. The problem is skimming. You just missed this when doing so:

by bloke » Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:20 am

bloke, on Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:20 am wrote:Here's the thing:
Sousaphones were designed as ~concert~ instruments.

You sort of neglected the fact that the sousaphones that were designed as ~concert~ instruments pretty quickly morphed into more bell forward (marching) than the helicon from which they sprang.

Concert (L); Marching (R)


Sorry Ian, all I had to offer was JSU 20J's ...