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Re: "amateur"/"professional" - skills not often discussed (h

Posted: Fri Nov 16, 2018 10:11 am
by Leland
Radar wrote:I do think there is one thing bloke left out regarding being an important characteristic of a pro: dependability and reliability (although not a playing characteristic). There are players in our area that are more instrumentally proficient than I am, but I've been told that I'm above some of them on call lists because the director knows if I agree to do the job I will be there well before the down beat, I'll be warmed up and in my seat prepared and ready to play, and I won't blow him off because a higher paying gig came along after I committed to his.
Yes to this. I think that dependability is at least as important as instrumental proficiency. When it comes down to it, music ensembles are still made up of people, not just instruments, and being able to work with other people pleasantly and dependably makes for a much nicer experience.

We've all been around musicians who are very good at making music and knowledgeable about their craft -- but who are just a bear to work with. Their characteristics include not showing up on time, talking too much during rehearsals, complaining about the rest of the group, talking back to the director (or, if they're the director, talking down to the group),... and then they turn around to execute the music at a positively stellar level.

I'd rather work with a pretty good player who's chill and dependable than an excellent player who's aggravating. Yeah, it's nice to end up with flawless recordings later, but I want to look forward to driving to rehearsals, too.

Re: "amateur"/"professional" - skills not often discussed (h

Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 10:28 am
by roweenie
+1, Leland...

Many years ago, as a young aspiring player, I was given these pearls by a very well-respected professional player, as to how to achieve success in the free-lance music business:

1) show up on time (meaning at least a half-hour early)

2) bring a music stand

3) keep your mouth shut

I was surprised to hear that "dexterity" and "skill" were not included (let alone "extremes of range", "ability to play multiphonics", or "know all my scales in every possible permutation"), but a short while after playing professionally (aka - my only source of income), it became painfully obvious to me why it wasn't included.

This may be a little cynical, but another wise old friend told me once, "the 'music business' is 10% music, and 90% business" - another one said, "most of the clients who will hire you, hear with their eyes".

Re: "amateur"/"professional" - skills not often discussed (h

Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:43 am
by Lee Stofer
Thank-you for a very good, thought-provoking post. We need more discussions like this. And, the post is very timely, as we approach the holiday season and lots of playing opportunities. Let's be prepared, arrive early and make the most of all our playing opportunities this season, regardless of whether it is a pay gig or not.

Re: "amateur"/"professional" - skills not often discussed (h

Posted: Fri Nov 23, 2018 3:14 pm
by rocksanddirt
quick random observation. I've been in some groups that spend a lot of time on tuning, and it doesn't really help as the members think of it like calibration. Once done it's correct until you turn the machine off.

Music is a form of communication and therefore takes listening and blending and all those lovely traits bloke listed up front to really have an ensemble bring the music.

Re: "amateur"/"professional" - skills not often discussed (h

Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2018 11:36 am
by Alex C
To me, a professional musician can be identified by 1) showing up ahead of time, 2) present and ready to play at the requested time, 3) able to play the part as indicated on the page, 4) does not need a rehearsal to "get it down," 5) is not a distraction or a drama queen, 6) is able to greet and then bid a friendly farewell at the end of the gig.

It is surprising how many time 2-3 and 4 just don't happen. Anybody can have a bad night with one or more of these but if you see someone over and over struggling to fit a technical pattern into a measure, that's an amateur.

The gig leader has a different set of parameters.

Re: "amateur"/"professional" - skills not often discussed (h

Posted: Tue Nov 27, 2018 1:38 am
by jperry1466
bloke wrote:...frankness communicates more clearly than euphemisms/apologetic adjectives/Newspeak/pc-speak/beating-around-the-bush, and more human beings (at least many Americans - once again, in my estimation) need to grow a reasonably thick skin and address issues, rather than defending issues.
i.e.
"bloke, Your entrance is late and your pitch is flat."
~vs.~
"bloke, I'm not immediately hearing your sound in the corporate sound, and it also doesn't seem to be resonating."
...and bloke (simply) fixing it, and not taking offense.
Agreed. Criticism is just that - critical assistance and not personal attack. And besides, it takes me a lot longer to figure out what said pc-speak person just said and meant than someone saying, "hey, you're flat and coming in late". I don't mind fixing a problem that I caused and sure don't get offended by it being pointed out to me.

Re: "amateur"/"professional" - skills not often discussed (h

Posted: Sun Dec 02, 2018 3:02 pm
by Leland
bloke wrote: i.e.
"bloke, Your entrance is late and your pitch is flat."
~vs.~
"bloke, I'm not immediately hearing your sound in the corporate sound, and it also doesn't seem to be resonating."

...and bloke (simply) fixing it, and not taking offense.
+1.

I had a chance to play a hornline rehearsal under Robert W. Smith, and he was excellent at dissecting what we just played, describing how it was incorrect, and what to do to fix it. He used zero personal attacks (like, "you must not be thinking about [blah blah]", etc) and made no comments about who we were or what our motivations were. He focused only on the product. We made greater strides in six hours than some of my other groups could make in a month.

Re: "amateur"/"professional" - skills not often discussed (h

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 8:46 am
by timothy42b
Alex C wrote:To me, a professional musician can be identified by 1) showing up ahead of time, 2) present and ready to play at the requested time, 3) able to play the part as indicated on the page, 4) does not need a rehearsal to "get it down," 5) is not a distraction or a drama queen, 6) is able to greet and then bid a friendly farewell at the end of the gig.

It is surprising how many time 2-3 and 4 just don't happen. Anybody can have a bad night with one or more of these but if you see someone over and over struggling to fit a technical pattern into a measure, that's an amateur.

The gig leader has a different set of parameters.
7. (subset of 2)). Brings all the equipment necessary. I can not imagine why a professional musician (paid, not a volunteer) would show up for a dimly lit church service and not bother to bring a stand light. Okay, once, but repeatedly? I've loaned mine many times, but shake my head every time. If a harpist has been hired, I don't even think twice, I throw an extra stand light in the bag for him/her.

8. (subset of 4) Sightreads instead of preparing. You had the music ahead of time, you're getting paid to play/sing/perform, and you don't do your homework. I've bit my tongue with paid soloists many a time, yesterday I slipped and said something. His reply, "I just show up and sing." Youngster, okay, but somewhere along the line a mentor should explain professionalism. We work on sightreading every day, but we never do it unnecessarily.

9. No Call, No Show, means I never hire you again and I call all my friends and pass the word. You have multiple phone numbers and email addresses, there's just no way you can't let me know.

Re: "amateur"/"professional" - skills not often discussed (h

Posted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 9:38 am
by timothy42b
bloke wrote: poorly-lit venue-provided music stands: That's (first/foremost) a sign of the venue owner/manager being unprepared...or (again) - blurring word meanings - being "unprofessional".
I agree with everything else, but Celtic evening services are designed to be contemplative, dimly lit with lots of candles. If you regularly do music for these, you know what to expect. Some local harpists and flutists do a lot of these. And show up, and ask for a light. Arghh.

I screwed up myself yesterday. I'd played this Christmas gig last year, in a brightly lit cafeteria space. This year they moved it to a dark orchestra pit and I didn't have a standlight myself, felt like an idiot since I'm a bit, er, critical of showing up unprepared. I usually have it in the bag, plus a couple of wire stands for others who forget, but I was charging the batteries and forgot to grab it.

One community band I fill in with played concerts in a dimly lit barn used by the theater department. I bought a 250 watt builder's flood light at Home Depot and set it up behind our row. Tubas and trombones could see fine; clarinets across from them not so much.

Re: "amateur"/"professional" - skills not often discussed (h

Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2018 12:47 pm
by dunelandmusic
With regards to find a place to play, I am friends with a guy who conducts band for home schoolers. They haven't had a tuba player in 10 years, so I get to play with them. No money, just joy. Just finished our two concerts for the holidays last night. Not very taxing, usually a cadet band, a symphonic band, and some orchestra pieces. Opportunities for ensemble play can be scarce. I'll keep playing what I'm offered.

Re: "amateur"/"professional" - skills not often discussed (h

Posted: Wed Dec 05, 2018 5:08 pm
by BrassedOn
Ted Cox wrote:Author Steven Pressfield has written a couple of books regarding the differences between amateurs and professionals.....The BEST sentence in both books comes at the end of The Art of War. Pressfield writes: "resistance is the dragon that guards the gold." Each of us must fight our very own dragon each and every day in order to recover the gold hidden within each of us.
Then rather than ‘professional’, tag me as ‘dragon slayer’.
I wake each day with sword in hand.

I always thought it was easier to identify an amateur, even when ‘twas me.