Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its doors.

The bulk of the musical talk
bone-a-phone
bugler
bugler
Posts: 171
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:02 am

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its door

Post by bone-a-phone »

basslizard wrote:

Out of curiosity, does their version of the 62H have the same non-standard trigger?
No. Kanstul had 2 versions, one dependent and one independent, both Bb/F/D with split triggers (thumb and middle finger).
User avatar
tbonesullivan
4 valves
4 valves
Posts: 531
Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2016 12:30 pm
Location: New Jersey

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its door

Post by tbonesullivan »

basslizard wrote:Out of curiosity, does their version of the 62H have the same non-standard trigger? E instead of the standard D is odd, and it's thrown me for a loop in playing mine. I've adjusted, but my son is still struggling with it. He's been playing it in our brass band while I play tuba. I'd love to play the two side by side. I love the tuning in the slide, and don't mind the dependent trigger for the E. It really does have a rich, gorgeous tone. It matches the vintage Conn trumpet I have, roughly the same year of production, both with the rose brass bells. Both date to about 1968, if I'm matching the serial numbers correctly.
Pretty much everyone moved on from the various double triggers to the split triggers, and it's a great thing that they did. Even with the "magic bar" and other ideas, it still is just so clunky when moving from the F to D.

Now, to get into Bass Trombone history, they originally came up with the idea for a dependent trigger to avoid the "E-Pull", which was a standard key that most bass trombonists were already used to. You would either have the trombone in Bb-F or Bb-E, so they kept it simple to avoid confusion. Then of course someone said "wait a minute, why stop at E? That was a bad idea, so lets do Eb." And then D followed. I usually suggest, if possible, that people who have a Bb-F-E, if possible, get a new crook made. Unfortunately it's not really easy, as you've gotta make it with bends so it won't run into the F-tubing.

I play a Yamaha YBL-621 RII, and I believe that the original 611 and 612 basses were based somewhat on the Conn 62 H bell tuning horn. It has a rather "interesting" wrap, and originally was only available in Bb/F/Eb. Then I think a D crook was available as a special option. Mine however came with an Eb and a D crook for the dependent valve. It is the last version, which has split triggers, which really just make it easier to use. Having to move the thumb back and forth, or somehow use the tip of the thumb separately is carpal tunnel waiting to happen.

Kanstul makes nice trombones. I have two of them, and they definitely worked all the bugs out of their 1570C and 1588CR horns. Now if only their leadpipes had been more consistent in length. The two horns come with the same three leadpipes, and none of the three match between the two horns.
Yamaha YBB-631S BBb Tuba, B&H Imperial Eb Tuba, Sterling / Perantucci 1065GHS Euphonium
Yamaha YBL-621 RII Bass Trombone and a bunch of other trombones
User avatar
Cthuba
bugler
bugler
Posts: 186
Joined: Mon Mar 01, 2010 11:57 pm

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its doors.

Post by Cthuba »

Bump. I just curious is anyone of any updates on the tubas if whether or not they will return to production?
Gnagey 4/4

That which is dead can eternal lie and with many strange aeons even tubas will fly
-A Misquote from HP Lovecraft.
User avatar
bisontuba
6 valves
6 valves
Posts: 4319
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 8:55 am
Location: Bottom of Lake Erie

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its doors.

Post by bisontuba »

I doubt it but call B.A.C. and ask them....
User avatar
Leland
pro musician
pro musician
Posts: 1649
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2004 11:54 am
Location: Washington, DC

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its doors.

Post by Leland »

BAC sells "System Blue"-branded instruments — according to their website today, at least — while not being authorized anymore to use the System Blue brand name.

https://twitter.com/TheBlueDevils/statu ... 5724546049

So the company still pings my sketchiness radar.
User avatar
SousaWarrior9
3 valves
3 valves
Posts: 428
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011 6:22 pm

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its doors.

Post by SousaWarrior9 »

Having met and spoken to some of the staff at BAC personally, I can say confidently that they have no plans to enter the tuba market at this time or the foreseeable future, and are hoping to sell off the tuba-related tooling as a complete set. They don't seem to be willing to parcel out specific mandrels and such at the moment, so whoever wants it is going to gave to take it all.

If only I had both the finances, space, and skill to do so...
"Some men are macho men. Others are Martin men"

It's that word "handcraft"...
Tubatooter
bugler
bugler
Posts: 26
Joined: Fri Feb 12, 2021 4:03 pm

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its doors.

Post by Tubatooter »

Now that I see someone else has said basically the same thing.....at 2010 ITEC I took home a euph to try. It was so horribly out of tune with itself that I found it unplayable. I couldn't understand their good reputation after that. Maybe their tubas were better.
Last edited by Tubatooter on Fri Oct 01, 2021 7:14 pm, edited 2 times in total.
TheodoreSmith
bugler
bugler
Posts: 127
Joined: Wed Feb 26, 2020 11:30 am
Location: North Indiana

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its doors.

Post by TheodoreSmith »

Kanstul didn't want to make stencils for other companies and it doomed them. Especially their marching brass stuff.
B&S PT-7PS
Yamaha Yeb-321
Lee Stofer
4 valves
4 valves
Posts: 928
Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2004 7:50 am

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its doors.

Post by Lee Stofer »

I was once a Kanstul dealer, and felt like that Kanstul was pretty flinty with his dealers. He was a premium maker of trumpets and trombones, and in later life tried to make a full line of brass instruments. Zigmant Kanstul was quite knowlegeable, but often very difficult to work with. He would ask for input from me on what his tubas should be like, then most often not take the advice. It is terribly expensive and labor-intensive to make tubas, not to mention not very profitable in today's economic atmosphere, and Kanstul just got in over his head, just to be able to say that he had made a full line of brass instruments. He did not make enough of any of the tuba or euphonium models to establish a routine where they could really be consistently great. Two of the finest euphoniums I've ever played were Kanstul, but there was no consistency. There were some that were very fine when they left the factory, but I did a lot of final-adjusting on most of what I sold, prior to the sale. One dealer bailed on Kanstul, saying that he was just finished with having to work on every tuba and euphonium before selling it. I have a repair shop, don't mind prepping instruments prior to sale, but it would have been nice if I would have gotten a discount on what would have been B-stock from any other maker.
My understanding is that Kanstul left the indebted business to his sons, while a daughter owned the premises. They worked hard and got out of debt, then the daughter sold the property. I was told that in the latter days, they were selling a number of instruments to China, but hardly anything in the USA. With such low domestic sales, it was the prudent thing to do to just close it down.
I have a few Kanstul parts left, and some of the tuba parts are very much like King parts on the 33/66/90 models. As for Kanstul making sousaphones, he always wanted to evade the question, but an eyewitness said he saw workers making parts for sousaphone bells at the factory, but for whom I could only guess.
Lee A. Stofer, Jr.
User avatar
Doug Elliott
pro musician
pro musician
Posts: 611
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:59 pm

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its doors.

Post by Doug Elliott »

TheodoreSmith wrote: Fri Sep 03, 2021 11:34 pm Kanstul didn't want to make stencils for other companies and it doomed them. Especially their marching brass stuff.
Before they got into the high end market using their own name, all they did was make was stencils. And most of it, or at least a large part, was marching brass.
User avatar
Leland
pro musician
pro musician
Posts: 1649
Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2004 11:54 am
Location: Washington, DC

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its doors.

Post by Leland »

One of their last large orders might've gone to the Marine D&B. Doug Elliott might remember a marching euph in G that I brought over (and he patiently helped figure out a mouthpiece config that made it play a bit less awful).
User avatar
Doug Elliott
pro musician
pro musician
Posts: 611
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:59 pm

Re: Kanstul instruments now that Kanstul has closed its doors.

Post by Doug Elliott »

Yes I remember you bringing that instrument to my exhibit. It was pretty horrible.
Post Reply