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Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 6:26 am
by kontrabasstuba
Hi,
My 497 Hagen has body is yellow brass. Bell and all the slides goldbrass. Leadpipe nickel silver. I have a better control with this combination and never any problems with red rott.
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 9:08 am
by cWEED
kontrabasstuba wrote:Hi,
My 497 Hagen has body is yellow brass. Bell and all the slides goldbrass. Leadpipe nickel silver. I have a better control with this combination and never any problems with red rott.
I'm a newer tubist, could you explain to me what red rott is?
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 2:21 pm
by Renodoc
I'm with cWeed- what is red rott? Doesn't sound good
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 2:40 pm
by The Big Ben
Red rott = red rot = corrosion in the brass which dissolves the brass. As you ,might guess, it's red.
If I'm not right, some member of the TNFJ will correct me and we will have a 75 post thread about it because that's what we do here.
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 3:28 pm
by LibraryMark
The Big Ben wrote:Red rott = red rot = corrosion in the brass which dissolves the brass. As you ,might guess, it's red.
If I'm not right, some member of the TNFJ will correct me and we will have a 75 post thread about it because that's what we do here.
OK - I'll bite. Brass is an alloy of copper and zinc. Actually the zinc is dissolving due to the corrosive nature of spit and a player's body chemistry, leaving behind just the copper. It can be prevented by keeping your horn clean and shooting some valve oil down the lead pipe from time to time.
Here's a much better explanation than mine:
https://northgeorgiaband.com/wp/the-imp ... -cleaning/
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 5:00 pm
by bort
This is a gold brass Hagen 495. Not on your list... but a handsome tuba all the same!
https://tubaforum.de/instrumente/b-tuba/" target="_blank" target="_blank
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 5:10 pm
by PeteDenton
I have a gold brass Hagen 496.
Love it!
I tend to be quite bright sounding player and find gold brass tends to mellow me out when compared with yellow brass. I've not actually played another Hagen (they're quite rare here in the UK) so can't give you a direct comparison.
I took it to a rehearsal in my UK brass band and our MD loved the sound compared with the usual instruments he has playing on BBb there.
I've not played it that much in anger yet but so far I'm thoroughly delighted with the purchase.
Pete
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 5:22 pm
by TubaKen
From the linked website (Northgeorgiabrass):
A player’s pH balance will determine the effects their body chemistry will have on the metal
Acidic saliva / perspiration will have a more profound dezincification effect and will more quickly damage plated surfaces and anything ferrous (screws, rods, steel springs, etc.). It will also attack solder joints and is especially destructive to valves and casings.
Alkaline saliva / perspiration contains many chemical salts and will result in a white build up (this is lime). It will damage lacquered finishes, form an abrasive coating on pistons, casings and rotors, as well as serve as the main catalyst for dezincification.
While “washing” a brass instrument regularly with mild soap and lukewarm water is always a good idea, it WILL NOT remove the damaging organics and stop the process of dezincification from inside the instrument! Only heavy acids (hydrochloric, sulfamic, sulfuric, etc.) can accomplish this!
Not to dispute the need for chemical cleaning, but some of these statements seem a little peculiar. In particular, I find it hard to believe that different people's salivary pH can vary that much. And how much saliva really gets into a horn? (I have some red rot in a old horn that is a good ten feet away from the mouthpipe!) The real culprit here (as Bloke and others have mentioned many times) is moisture. Using large quantities of oil will help, by displacing the water (which evaporates more readily than the fairly viscous valve oil.) Want to store a horn for a long period? Pull all the valves and slides and let it thoroughly air dry for a couple days. Most of the discussions of dezincification online have to do with brass fittings used in plumbing or for naval use (i.e. continuously exposed to water.) One method used to prevent it: add arsenic!
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 9:57 pm
by MartyNeilan
You have to plug it in???
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 10:04 pm
by Three Valves
Those Euro plugs will never work over here...
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Feb 25, 2020 10:44 pm
by Heavy_Metal
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 9:13 am
by LibraryMark
MartyNeilan wrote:
You have to plug it in???
That must be the cathodic corrosion protection system.
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Wed Feb 26, 2020 10:37 am
by MN_TimTuba
Brett,
I did look this up on your post from another thread - it is a gorgeous horn!
Tim
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Tue Mar 03, 2020 5:36 am
by pjv
I tried 2 495's in complete gold and didn't like them compared to the yellow. It felt like the liveliness (and my air) got sucked out. I had a similar experience with a 91B.
Of coarse, who can say that my experience was directly caused by the gold brass.
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 4:33 pm
by PeteDenton
I tried 2 495's in complete gold and didn't like them compared to the yellow. It felt like the liveliness (and my air) got sucked out
I'm a bright sounding player and find the gold brass mellows my sound nicely.
Goes to show that it's about a blend of instrument and player to get the result you want and what's good for one person might not be good for the next...
Re: Has anyone tried a Goldbrass Hagen?
Posted: Wed Mar 04, 2020 4:50 pm
by pjv
again I'd like to stress the fact that there really is no way to tell if the two horns I tried "sucked" (sorry) because of the gold brass, or for other reasons which had nothing to do with the material whatsoever (my playing included).
Always choose the best tuba, no matter what it's made of.