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Hello everyone,

a little background info first: having finished my conservatory studies, I completely lost access to F tubas. I waited for some time to see if regular playing is still possible (turns out it is), and then went ahead to look for my new own F tuba. Since I am rather short and small (and I don’t have to compete with anyone anymore), I was looking into average-at-most-sized tubas to suit me and to be fun to play. Which obviously means that I bought the biggest meanest tuba I tried.

I picked up my Willson 3200 RZ-5 in Germany about two months ago. It is about 20 years old, though it certainly looks almost like new. If it wasn’t for the missing lacquer on the 4th valve button, nobody would tell it is not a new tuba. There are a few scratches here and there, but you really need to look for them to see them.

The first thing that surprised me was how heavy it is. The rumors were certainly true! Then I tried playing a few tones... and boy was I blown away. I have never felt such a presence of sound as much as when playing the Willson. I guess the huge 450 mm bell helps in that regard. The sound is incredibly solid and big, if anyone is looking for a small C or big F tuba, then this must be the ultimate small-C-or-big-F tuba. When I took it along with my small BBb to a local 14-member brass band (you would probably call that "polka band" in the USA), it stood its ground very bravely and could pretty much match the sound of the BBb with more presence. I can't think of a better all-round tuba for the majority of chamber music.

The bottom range is unlike any F tuba I have played. The dreaded low C is perfect. It starts to get a bit stuffy around G/Gb below staff, but hey, it’s an F tuba, so that can’t be unexpected. Pedals are easy and sound nice and full. The mid range is really solid, too. The high range took (and will continue to take) some getting used to, but it is starting to sound sweet as well. Surprisingly, the always problematic (at least for me) Db and D above staff are super easy to play (again, unlike any other F tuba I have played). Playing above F is somewhat hard, but how often do I get to play there? I’d rather have a tuba with 95 % of the range easily accessible and 5 % more difficult, than the other way around. And F tubas, from my experience, always require some compromises, after all.

The intonation is very good as well. There are a few exceptions – Ab in staff being sharp, F/E/Eb below staff being flat, low G being sharp, but that’s about it. No weird fingerings needed for anything above Ab in staff, which is pretty cool! Still, I am considering having a trigger installed to help out with those few difficult tones. I am very glad there is no super-sharp C in staff and other quirks that, say, Miraphone has. I'll happily trade my sharp Ab for a super sharp-C.

The valves are not as perfect. They are reliable, but feel really tough and heavy. That all being said, Arutiunian concerto 3rd movement (which I like to play when testing valves) is easily playable with them. Just that.. it could be even easier on such a horn. Perhaps the springs don’t have to be so hard? Not sure. The throw is somewhat long as well. The valveset and thumb ring seem positioned perfectly for someone with hands about twice the size of my own. If the valve paddles were a bit closer to the body of the tuba and the thumb ring was lower, I think it would be much easier to play. I might have some adjustements done there. The paddles have buttons on them, which I personally find comfortable (plus moving them could facilitate modifying ergonomics to suit me better).

I don't mind the horn being so heavy. Perhaps it's just a placebo effect, but it feels really sturdy and built like a tank. Playing it also has a very specific feel to it. It allows you to use as much air as you like without overblowing the horn. It is the only F tuba I have played that feels that way – it is able to easily match what you put into it without sucking air from you. Some tubas tend to simply stop taking in more air or require insane amounts of it all the time, but not this one. It feels like turning a volume knob, no changes in sound in any way – it feels like it does precisely what you tell it to do. And then it projects like crazy.

Overall, an unbeatable sound, very good intonation, good valves and mediocre ergonomics. Fortunately, adjusting the thumb ring is easier than fixing a bad sound or poor intonation.

Finally, it should be noted that the tuba was priced at a significant discount comparing to a new one. It cost just slightly more than some new Chinese tubas, say a new silver plated Wessex Linz or John Packer JP379FF.

Have a nice day and stay healthy!
Petr

More photos.

That's gorgeous. I used to own a rotary 3050-RZ CC tuba, and pretty much everythin you've said was true. Amazing sound (just incredible!), so easy to play, and very fun.

But... the physical weight was too much, and the angle of the valve section was not comfortable for me. I had already put a lot of money into the tuba to replace the valve linkages with new Willson parts, and to do more surgery to the tuba was just going to be too much more $.

One of the last things I did with my tuba -- which was a great idea, was to have the Rotax rotors cut down to be more like regular rotary valves. I wrote about it here:

viewtopic.php?f=27&t=86633" target="_blank" target="_blank

Photos... I'm not sure I ever posted them I'll try to look them up.

The un-Rotax project is a one-way street for sure, but I would do it again if I had the chance. It made a HUGE difference in how the tuba played and the valve action.

I miss that rotary Willson tuba sometimes. But the weight and ergonomics just didn't work out for me, and I realize that more and more as time goes on. It is an excellent tuba though, and the build quality is the best!

For anyone interested in a valve paddle mod on the Willson rotary CC tubas (maybe it'd also apply to the F tubas?):

http://www.daveamason.com/willson/wills ... evised.pdf" target="_blank

Robb Stewart made the switch, although he no longer works on tubas. Especially tubas that weigh as much as a dump truck.

My horn didn't have a lot of ground zero feedback, but it sure projected like crazy. No problem hearing it out in the hall. Quite a different animal from the piston 3050.

Thanks for the replies!

Yes, Bort, if you could find the pictures, it would be helpful! I am hesitant to do such a major surgery, obviously, but it would be nice having something in store in case I will eventually decide to go for it. I would first need to find a competent brass tech nearby, though. I do not trust anyone in the Czech republic enough – IF I were to go for it, I think I would have to go to Germany or Austria to have it done properly. I will probably see a tech first, have the valves thoroughly cleaned and set up to their best abilities, move the thumb ring, and only then decide about cutting them...

Thanks for the photos, Dave! My tuba is not as wildly un-ergonomic as the CC, fortunately...

I might add that I got to intimately know two other F tubas in the last 10 years: Miraphone Premium (about as old as my new tuba) and Wessex Strauss (new 3 years ago).

The Miraphone had faster valves (though not as reliable), better ergonomics, and overall just felt nicely made. Compared to the Willson now, though... it just didn't feel THAT nicely made (could be the placebo effect of the weight of the Willson, but I don't think it's just that). The intonation was really wild, as well. Also, some tones were easy, some less so – high G was super easy, but high Gb almost impossible to play. The Willson is much simpler in this regard, all the tones seem to have the same very wide "slots". The upper mid range required a lot of alternative fingerings. Not a problem with the Willson. The Miraphone, while not bad, felt ... simply inconsistent compared to the Willson. A new Miraphone F could be better, of course, but that would cost more than twice as much as my Willson.

The Wessex had OK intonation and poor valves. I tried playing a colleague's tuba (the same model), which was somewhat clunkier, but otherwise felt and played much better. The quality of the build is uncomparable to the Willson, though (although Wessex probably improved since then). I was impressed by the new Wessex rotary F (Linz?), but I felt like the valves would be just as poor as with the Straus, so I went ahead to look for a used tuba for the same price instead.

Here's a photo of the "before" rotary valves.



I don't have a photo of the "after" valves (I forgot to take a photo, and this was a few years ago), but Martin Wilk cut away the "extra" metal on the rotax valves and made them basically look just like normal rotary valves. Like this:



The tuba was even better after this modification. The ergonomics were still bad for me, and ultimately the reason I sold it. I don't think I realized when I owned the tuba, just how poor the ergonomics were for me. I'd like to think with a little work, Willson could make a heck of a good rotary CC tuba. But the cost of a brand new one would be prohibitive (the 3050RZ is $20,000+ by this point), and there are just far too many options below that price point that people will find just as good or better.