TubeNet

Many of the scores we play in concert band will have the tuba parts split into divisi octaves. I understand that this probably originated with the use of Eb and BBb horns in the section. But what should we do when all the horns in the section are BBb? Do we all play the bottom part or should one of us play the upper part?
Generally, we tend to play "what ever note you can hit", but if we are all BBb horns should we all play the lower part. Personally, I like playing the lower octave as it just has more presence.

Cheers!
Play safe.

I prefer the upper octave just because I don't have the lung capacity of a larger person, and let the Big Lungs put in the basement if I have the option. I think if the upper octave is in the music, there may be a good reason (or may not, depending on whose arrangement it is) and it would add to the fullness of the sound. I also in brass band have played the Eb part on a euphonium and the conductor liked the addition to the sound, lighter but present.

My high school band director, who was Navy School of Music trained, following the Sousa tradition, told us to play the lower notes. Others have had the section split, or depending on the actual line, at times play the upper note for clarity and continuity. What that really means is that it comes down to the part and how many tuba players are in section.

This does NOT mean that a player should gratuitously drop an octave just to show he/she can, or to provide some perceived "gravitas" to the line, because without specific direction to do so by the conductor, it can cause everything to turn to mud.

Most of the time the need was three tubas before the upper octave starts getting used. And even with four tubas, it’s oftentimes just one on the upper part.

Where things get interesting is when you get split fifths.

When you get split fifths is when the players have to have a working ear. Those of us who have tuned stringed instruments all our lives know what perfect fifths sound like. It can get interesting as to which player needs to adjust, depending on the rest of the chord.

Besides "how many tubas," what does the rest of the low brass section look like?

How many euphs?
How strong are the trombones?
And my big beef -- what's the bass trombone player like? Strong or weak? Bright or dark? Blatty or appropriately direct?

I seem to put a LOT of emphasis on the bass trombone sound in a band, and the way that it blends with the tuba sound. In college, we were spoiled with some VERY good bass trombone players, and even in one of my former community bands, we had an excellent former military band bass trombone player. Having a strong and dark bass trombone sound makes a ton of difference. It does not relieve the tuba section from needing clarity and accuracy in articulations... but it sure helps the tuba section to NOT need to be punchier than it needs to be.

Anyway, my general advice:
[*]1 tuba -- bottom always
[*]2 tubas -- split, if you have a very strong player on the bottom. If no strong player, then both on bottom.
[*]more than 2 tubas -- only one tuba on top; whoever has the smallest horn (or Eb, or F). Strongest player should stay on the bottom.
[*]Don't ask the conductor; that's just asking for trouble at that point. Let them tell you if they don't like it.
[*]If it's an older march or something that says "Basses", ignore those top notes.

Another added complication...

If the tubas are in octaves for the most part but not all the time (i.e., the arranger was avoiding anything below four ledger lines or above a certain note...), you need to look at the other parts and figure out if the line is supposed to be on the bottom or top. If it is clear that the contour of the line in the other instruments is consistent with you playing the upper octave, then do that. If it's clear that the contour of the line is the lower octave, then do that.

Then the extra credit -

If you have enough players AND YOU CAN MAKE IT SOUND MUSICAL, you can modify the OTHER octave as needed to play the line. For example, if it is apparent that the arranger did not want to write anything below a four-ledger E, but playing the D below that would be musically justifiable AND you can do it musically AND the upper octave is appropriately covered, then my opinion has always been to go for it. But if that cannot be done for any reason, just play the upper octave.

That all being said -

General rule: The stronger player should cover the bottom octave.

Generaler rule: Do it the way it sounds best with your instrumentation and your players. Whatever sounds best/most appropriate/most musical is always the right choice.

Generalist rule: Except for extreme examples, as long as it is played competently, no one will notice.

I don't have other tubas to worry about, just me. I try to guess from context which one might be the principle note. I suppose more often than not I end up on the low road, but not as often as I did when I was playing BBb. Now that lately I'm on a largish Eb, when it's a toss-up I might take the high road a little more often than I used to, particularly with something like a run of notes an octave below the staff. Of course a lot depends on the ensemble. I'm in a band with mostly very casual amateur players, no bass trombone, no bari sax, playing band music from about a century ago.

Agree with bort's general advice, with one exception: I follow Donn's advice if it's just me. Sometimes the line makes more sense taking the higher octave.

Not all composers (arrangers, editors, etc) take the same care when writing their tuba parts. Some took great care, but were written with different instrumentation and/or performance practice in mind.

A march might have octave splits for notes under the staff to accommodate double basses reading the same part. Some older English tuba parts might have splits for anything below low A to accommodate players on 3-valve E-flats. A work commissioned for high school band could include low register accommodations that the composer might not consider if commissioned for a college group.

Even some of the most important works for concert band have questionable tuba editing. Take the Holst 1st Suite (Matthews ed.). The octave divisi G in the opening phrase really should be performed as the low G. The tuba part at A has a top octave added in for some reason for only 3 measures. I know it might be sacrilege to insult the sacred texts, but most of the divisi in Holst 1 really should be performed bottom octave only IMO.

With some of the new composers, they work closely with some of the top college and professional bands in the country and are very familiar with what the tuba can do. What the tuba can do, however, is not always what the tuba should do to make it sound musical in a functionally performable way. Sometimes you gotta just look at those fff fast passages in the basement register and make a "business decision" to leave out the bottom octave.

bort wrote:conductor; Let them tell you if they don't like it.

Only hard and fast rule!

Don't have someone taking the upper octave or dropping octaves if they can't play those notes in tune.

timayer wrote:Another added complication...

If you have enough players AND YOU CAN MAKE IT SOUND MUSICAL, you can modify the OTHER octave as needed to play the line. For example, if it is apparent that the arranger did not want to write anything below a four-ledger E, but playing the D below that would be musically justifiable AND you can do it musically AND the upper octave is appropriately covered, then my opinion has always been to go for it. But if that cannot be done for any reason, just play the upper octave.

I do this all the time. Quite often it's obvious what the composer/arranger's idea was of what a tuba's lower range is so they will make low parts jump up in odd spots even though it makes no sense musically. If there is a descending line that would go well below the weeds if it weren't for the writer "chickening out", I follow the line down as low as it should go - pedal BBb and beyond. I can see why a part might have been written that way for a high school tuba player who can't play much below BBb. But if you've got the range, I say go for it. Quite often when I do that I get a knowing smile from the director.

Ask the conductor

cjk wrote:Ask the conductor

I agree, and will offer the provision: Email the conductor before rehearsal.

Re: Brett's - Anyway, my general advice:
[*]1 tuba -- bottom always
[*]2 tubas -- split, if you have a very strong player on the bottom. If no strong player, then both on bottom.
[*]more than 2 tubas -- only one tuba on top; whoever has the smallest horn (or Eb, or F). Strongest player should stay on the bottom.
[*]Don't ask the conductor; that's just asking for trouble at that point. Let them tell you if they don't like it.
[*]If it's an older march or something that says "Basses", ignore those top notes.

That's almost completely my plan. Only real difference is, if I'm the only tuba then I'll often play the upper octave notes (not 5ths) first time thru, then the lower octave on the repeat, both for the sake of variety and to add noticeable fullness the second time around. But that's just me.

That reminds me of when I was in conducting class and the professor, who was a solid conductor, said, “Never admit to being wrong even when you have no idea.”

THE TUBA wrote:....Even some of the most important works for concert band have questionable tuba editing. Take the Holst 1st Suite (Matthews ed.). The octave divisi G in the opening phrase really should be performed as the low G. The tuba part at A has a top octave added in for some reason for only 3 measures. I know it might be sacrilege to insult the sacred texts, but most of the divisi in Holst 1 really should be performed bottom octave only IMO.

I would suggest that in the 1st movement Peasante, just before letter C, the upper notes should be played. It looks like that divisi is designed for young players, who are not secure on the upper part.

GC wrote:Don't have someone taking the upper octave or dropping octaves if they can't play those notes in tune.

+1

Ace

Our community band conductor has been Tubist with the Augsburg Symphony, as well as Professor for Tuba, Euph, and concertband conducting at the Augsburg School of Music. (Yes, they have a Curriculum that will deal with concert band and its variations in contrast to Symphony orchestra).

So 1) he can tell differences in Tuba section work and 2) he WILL adress issues during practise, offering INFORMED Solutions to tuba-related problems.
(Yes, I am a very happy Tubist in that band and am prepared to cope with Your envy )

In a 35-40 piece community band with 3-4 tubists, the Modus Operandi is as follows:
- There is no "1st Tuba", even Eb-guy gets 2nd part literature.
- Divisi passages in octave parallels: maximum 1 on top, all others at bottom.
- Divisi passages in quint parallels: Audience will perceive this as the octave below (Brain notices 2nd and 3rd partials of an imaginary low note and calculates that note on its own). So that´s the note the Composer actually wanted to write, but "chickened out of" . So it´ll be 1 on top, 1-2 on bottom line, and Yours truly an octave below bottom line.