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It looks like it is excellent shape for its age. Hard to tell from the pictures on my computer, but that doesn't look like the original neck to me. The buy it now price of $7500 seems a bit rich to me.

tofu wrote:It looks like it is excellent shape for its age. Hard to tell from the pictures on my computer, but that doesn't look like the original neck to me. The buy it now price of $7500 seems a bit rich to me.

A bit rich ??? $7500 for something totally impractical is , IMHO , KRAZY !!!!

jamsav wrote:

tofu wrote:It looks like it is excellent shape for its age. Hard to tell from the pictures on my computer, but that doesn't look like the original neck to me. The buy it now price of $7500 seems a bit rich to me.

A bit rich ??? $7500 for something totally impractical is , IMHO , KRAZY !!!!

The price is way high and, I'm sure, the seller will find out when it doesn't sell. I would guess the seller will lower the price or put it back into the closet with the other overpriced stuff.

Impractical? Not any more than any upright bell for marching. It's done but the front bell seems to be better for the sousaphone. Would be kind of cool in a band dressed up in uniforms of the time period....

Not at that price, though...

Impractical? Not any more than any upright bell for marching. It's done but the front bell seems to be better for the sousaphone. Would be kind of cool in a band dressed up in uniforms of the time period....

Not at that price, though...[/quote]
Agreed, I marched with an upright for yrs, but this defeats the whole reason behind a sousaphone. If you got 8 rain catchers blowing it up in the air thats one thing , or if you're marching in period costumes, very cool, but , if you want to be heard , well , I 'll line up in the last row and blow the helmet off of the drum major with my old Carl Fischer....

I have seen a horn quite like this one. It was in my wife's 1958 high school annual (Bremerton, WA, High School). The horn there was an ordinary Conn sousaphone but had a special Conn bell, in this configuration, attached. My wife told me Bill Bissel, the director, had gotten the bell for some reason, probably to use in an Oompah or Hungry 5 band the kids had.

But, you are right! $7500 dollars? No way. Maybe he meant $750?

Look down the page a bit and you will see a group of mouthpieces for sale that has some pretty useful ones and an effective 10 mouthpiece holder, for $350. This is only $35 each and, while most of the mouthpieces are worth $20-25, one of them is a Rose Model Solo.

IMHO, the seller has seen too many installments of Antiques Roadshow.

jamsav wrote:

tofu wrote: The buy it now price of $7500 seems a bit rich to me.

A bit rich ??? $7500 for something totally impractical is , IMHO , KRAZY !!!!

Apparently you missed the implied humor of a "bit rich". As far as practical I doubt anybody would buy it as a "practical instrument" for marching down the street. However, as someone who owns a Besson New Standard which I view as an impractical instrument to march with and yet there are people who do - which if I recall you have written you have done so in the past. So I guess practicality is a matter of each viewer's own perspective.

If you look at old photographs of Sousa's band through the years you will often see raincatchers and upright tubas used in concert settings. Quite frankly there is no reason a high quality Sousaphone such as a Conn 40K, but with an upright bell couldn't rightfully take it's place in a modern orchestra. Other than it's looks being out of place - the function in the hall would be the same. Unfortunately, the shape to most orchestra goers/conductors shouts Marching Band and thus not of high quality and unworthy of a fine orchestra. However our own TubeNet Bloke has used his 5 valve CC Helicon in the orchestra he plays in to much acclaim.

Raincatcher sousaphones ARE practical. They were made to suit BOTH marching and concert settings. The bell collar is where it is so the bell can be tilted from the upright position to the forward position. It's not just a typical upright detachable bell like on a tuba. Players were usually pictured with them 'bell-up' because (1) when the bell was forward it blocked the player's face and/or (2) to show off why they call 'em raincatchers. The bell mod' was done to fit larger bells and was seen as a step backwards by players of the time. They went out of fashion because most schools already had concert tubas and didn't need a 'do-it-all' horn.


The price is crazy but a nice one might sell for $2000-$2500.

(another Bay find)
http://cgi.ebay.com/RAINCATCHER-SOUSAPH ... 5633773362" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

Looking at the serial # and the construction, its quite possible that the other horns a Pan-American. http://cgi.ebay.com/RAINCATCHER-SOUSAPH" target="_blank ... 5633773362"

KiltieTuba wrote:I would disagree, if you wear the instrument properly, the bell would tip to the left or right as opposed to forward, just look at all the old photos of how they wear them. It's definitely designed so that it can be moved left or right depending on how the player's body is shaped.

I'm not saying they were perfectly designed, that they are comfortable to hold/play, that it couldn't benefit from modification, or that the bell pointed out exactly in front of the player. The point is that the bell is adjustable for both parade and concert use. I haven't seen enough good head-on photos of raincatchers being played in the marching configuration to say if the bell shoots out directly in front of the player or slightly to the side. The sousaphone players in the good old days may have even held them differently depending on use and bell angle. Even if it points to the side it's STILL an upright/helicon Hybrid.

Mike-ICR wrote:

KiltieTuba wrote:I would disagree, if you wear the instrument properly, the bell would tip to the left or right as opposed to forward, just look at all the old photos of how they wear them. It's definitely designed so that it can be moved left or right depending on how the player's body is shaped.

I'm not saying they were perfectly designed, that they are comfortable to hold/play, that it couldn't benefit from modification, or that the bell pointed out exactly in front of the player. The point is that the bell is adjustable for both parade and concert use. I haven't seen enough good head-on photos of raincatchers being played in the marching configuration to say if the bell shoots out directly in front of the player or slightly to the side. The sousaphone players in the good old days may have even held them differently depending on use and bell angle. Even if it points to the side it's STILL an upright/helicon Hybrid.

I would agree with you. My band has one that we keep in our music library - I will have to haul it out and give it a try on the march. The first one mentioned in this thread (the $7500 one) is dated if I recall as 1924. That must have been one of the last of the Raincatchers made I would guess. Looking at the body it is identical to my Conn Helicon of that vintage which is basically the 14K Sousaphone. I've used my 30K Helicon for parades and it is a monster sound and is so light that it is a joy to use. The direction of the bell is not hard to manipulate to some degree and doesn't seem to be a problem because the front of the band always mentions how good the sousaphones sounded when I use it and this is large group on the street. So that might just be a decent playing raincatcher. The other one you posted dates from 1900 and I would be curious how well that design plays when in good shape. There are a lot of factors involved in pricing stuff like this, but I think you're in the ballpark for a decent one at 2K-2.5k.

no, I didnt miss it, but bad punctuation on my part . Should have read " a bit ? rich...", and as far as impractical, its only problematic from the perspective of being heard . If you're familiar with Sousas bands , and it seems you are, by todays standard, he had a disproportionate # of sousaphone, tubas , raincatchers ...and guys like A. Helleberg and Mr Bell pushing air thru them. Those guys were heard !! A Sousy in concert band ( assuming its a decent horn ) will project much the same as a recording bell . Ditto the comparison between a raincatcher and an upright tuba .
The Besson is completely impractical, unless of course you happen to march with the Britsh Royal Marines, Grenadier Guards or the Salvation Army pro band here in the US .
Well, I dont, so I have sold the Besson - too damned heavy to lug around , not agile enough for Dixie and Polka , stuffy in concert setting - God , I love those horns - go figure ....