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I've never played tuba/euphonium before, and am thinking of taking lessons.

Is this a good euphonium to buy to figure out if I like the instrument, or would this end up being a doorstop?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Holton- ... 1c455d92be" target="_blank" target="_blank

I'm a 55 y.o. adult. Not sure if this is a full sized euphonium or if I would need full sized.

Thanks for your replies.

You would be much better getting a 4 valve euphonium, preferably compensated.

A 3 valve like this very limits what music you can play

Being that that Holton is so reasonable, I think that would be fine just to find out if you want to play euphonium. But as Neptune pointed out, a 4-valve horn would be better suited if you want to continue playing. You could probably resell the Holton horn.

When I got back into playing 14 yrs ago (age 53 and after a 33 yr break), I bought a "3 banger". After a few months I upgraded to a 4-valve compensator.

My opinion for what it's worth.

Neptune wrote:You would be much better getting a 4 valve euphonium, preferably compensated.

A 3 valve like this very limits what music you can play

Nonsense.

A 3 valve euphonium can serve you well for a few years (and perhaps beyond). After you achieve competency (and decide if you even like playing the euphonium), you can then determine if a 4th valve is needed based on your progress, goals, ensemble participation, input from your instructor, budget etc.

I agree with the posters who have said a 3-valve instrument will be fine to dip your toe in and see if you like it - and shouldn't be a problem to sell if you decide to upgrade at some point.

That Holton on eBay isn't a bad deal, but for a little bit more there is a 3-valve used Jupiter for sale from a dealer at Baltimore Brass. I'd go with it before the Holton where there is some uncertainty about the condition, and the Holton case is in pretty bad shape.
http://baltimorebrass.net/index.php?cat=4" target="_blank

Either one though are easily re-sellable for close to what you'd be putting into it.

That euphonium at Baltimore Brass looks good.

I was speaking with an instructor who said that a euphonium might be for a person who is smaller and can't handle a tuba.

He recommended a brand new anthem tuba at $1,500. Does that sound reasonable for a newbie?

If you decide to stay the euphonium route, here is a nice one in the American style, and this one has 4 valves. It's in very good shape and much newer.

http://www.dwerden.com/forum/showthread ... aight-Bell

tezza wrote: I was speaking with an instructor who said that a euphonium might be for a person who is smaller and can't handle a tuba

That's pure Bravo Sierra!

Good with the Jupiter on Baltimore Brass.

There are little size differences between smaller "student" euphonium and larger "professional" euphoniums so I don't think it would matter much . (What's an inch or two here and there and a couple pounds weight difference)


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I have to say that some of your comments have left me perplexed, if I take them at face value. I can't exactly figure this one out:

tezza wrote:I was speaking with an instructor who said that a euphonium might be for a person who is smaller and can't handle a tuba.

The euphonium and tuba are similar, but considerably different instruments. This is especially true when it comes to the role that each instrument plays in music. (Ok, not for the beginner stuff, but in the long run). Plus, the difference in weight between between the two is a considerable factor for certain people of smaller builds or of older ages.

If you want to play euphonium, play euphonium. If you want to play tuba, play tuba. If you want to play a large brass instrument for fun, play euphonium. It'll be more fun in the beginning, and you can always get a tuba later on if you choose to do so.
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Don't buy a new instrument yet(you'll likely end up wanting something else and lose some money in the deal), in the worse case try renting from one of the local music stores for a month or two.

Thanks very much for your feedback!

I was bringing up the euphonium versus tuba comment to see what people think.

I'm a little more attracted to the euphonium because it's smaller and lighter and seems to given to both melodic and 'fundamental note" tasks.

An instructor will be showing me a $1,500 new "anthem" tuba (not sure what that is, can't find any reference to it), so I should get a better idea of tuba size just by looking handling it.

I'm am attracted to the lower prices of a basic euphonium, as I would be in a bit of a tough place if I spent a lot of money and found out I didn't have a long term interest. So the $300 - $800 items mentioned here look good.

I very much appreciate the feedback, it's a bit of a head spinner as a newbie.

A good used horn from a reputable manufacturer/dealer is almost always better (and less expensive) than a new no-name student instrument. Based on that recommendation alone, I would look for another instructor. Additionally... you should play the instrument with the sound that you find appealing and will inspire you to make music. Size doesn't matter unless you have physical limitations that might make playing a particular instrument (large or small) difficult.

I've have at least several hours on the following 3 valve euphoniums with bores of .570 or greater. Used horns for $500 or less (often much less) that I've picked up for new students:
Yamaha YEP201 (bell up)
Yamaha YEP211 (bell front)
Jupiter 468L (bell up)
Jupiter 466L (bell up; convertible to marching configuration)

The Yamaha horns have a characteristic euphonium sound, decent intonation and are well made. If you find a used one, be sure to ask about/check the condition of the upper and lower valve casing threads as cross-threading is common. I once played a pretty beat-up silver YEP201 that was the best student euphonium I've encountered. Holton and Bach sold (sell?) Yamaha-manufactured horns, which often sell for less than the Yamaha counterpart. Be sure to verify that a prospective horn is made in Japan (usually indicated on one of the valve casings). I have a Holton-stenciled YEP211 ($200 shipped via eBay!) that is an excellent horn. It didn't 'limit' my ability to play everything in my concert band's repertoire to my and the band director's satisfaction. It's everything that the YEP201 is without having the bell in you ear.

The quality of construction of the Jupiter horns is decent, but not quite that of the Yamahas. I found the 466L to be the better of the two in terms of intonation and sound quality. We never used the horn in marching configuration. I don't know the bore of the horn at Baltimore Brass, but it would be worth asking in my opinion.

Conn, King and Holton have also produced some very fine 3 valve euphoniums (around .562" bore; often referred to as baritone horns) that can be purchased inexpensively and would serve you well. I happen to be a fan of the Conn 14I.

Many nice horns can be found for $400 or less on eBay. Spending a bit more to buy a good used horn that's been checked over carefully by a reputable dealer (e.g., Dillon, Baltimore Brass, Brass Exchange, Brass Ark, Village Tinker; some of the other Tubenet sponsors) isn't a bad idea.

At any rate... since you seem torn between euphonium and tuba, a discussion with a band director who has a low brass background or perhaps a college instructor might be helpful in terms of picking an instrument and finding a competent instructor.

quote="tezza"]That euphonium at Baltimore Brass looks good.

He recommended a brand new anthem tuba at $1,500. Does that sound reasonable for a newbie?[/quote]

The King on EBay is a classic and beautiful American Style euphonium well worth the difference in price from Baltimore Brass Jupiter. The beauty of forums such as this is the access to opinions from pros like Dave Werden. His advice is spot on.

tezza wrote:I was speaking with an instructor who said that a euphonium might be for a person who is smaller and can't handle a tuba.

He recommended a brand new anthem tuba at $1,500. Does that sound reasonable for a newbie?

There has been one for sale here. Small tuba of Chinese origin, marketed by a music dealer Anthem in Massachusetts. You might be able to get a decent price on the used one in For Sale, if you're more or less in the same area and it's still for sale.

As already mentioned, the tuba and euphonium are related but profoundly different. Even a relatively small ("3/4 size") tuba like that Anthem is still a tuba, and playing it is a different game with a different objective, compared to baritone where you're more of a melody instrument, albeit technically "background."

tezza wrote:That euphonium at Baltimore Brass looks good.

I was speaking with an instructor who said that a euphonium might be for a person who is smaller and can't handle a tuba.

He recommended a brand new anthem tuba at $1,500. Does that sound reasonable for a newbie?

I'm 6'7" and 300 pounds. I play euphonium. It's not about size, it's about what you prefer to play.

WARNING: HIGHLY OPINIONATED MATERIAL AHEAD!!!!

Still the best euph for the money is thr Yamaha YEP-321. I prefer the sound of silver. They are in the $2,300-$3,000 range, new.

Good luck!

I'm betting that that instructor is getting a commission on the euph he is trying to get you to buy. I second the opinion to look for a different instructor.

Go for the instrument whose sound appeals to you. That is why we all play what we do. At 100# dripping wet and 5'3" tall I have been welcome on the tuba in bands and orchestras, as well as the euphonium.

MA