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Well the main tuning slide sure has had work done to it in the past. But look at the 1st and 2nd valve circuits. They are reversed......the 1st valve is a half-step; second valve is full-step. Kinda weird.

The paddle rack looks quite similar to the one on my Alex- adjusting wheels and all.

lowbrassmaniac wrote:If it's indeed maybe a CC horn, that 1st slide is probably a bear, too short and looks like it's stuck. Cool old horn but plays sharper than a butcher knife.

Someone on a previous thread about this horn said that some early German tubas had a half step in the first valve and a whole step in the second valve - basically as if our modern 1st and 2nd valve were swapped. That seems to be the case here.

I once played a 1900s Sandner (or maybe it was a Sander... not Sanders) CC that had a major third length 3rd valve instead of the typical minor third. Eb was played 3rd valve, etc. Interesting systems in these old horns.

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The left tuba is nearly the same, though with the standard valve system. It also has that crazy slide, and is a Hüller. According to horn-u-Copia, the left horn is in Eb! Not sure how accurate that is, it looks like c or Bb to me.

I'll just post that image here directly:



If the horn on the left is an Eb, perhaps it underwent a similar F --> Eb conversion? Or high-low pitch?

arpthark wrote:
Someone on a previous thread about this horn said that some early German tubas had a half step in the first valve and a whole step in the second valve - basically as if our modern 1st and 2nd valve were swapped. That seems to be the case here.

I once played a 1900s Sandner (or maybe it was a Sander... not Sanders) CC that had a major third length 3rd valve instead of the typical minor third. Eb was played 3rd valve, etc. Interesting systems in these old horns.

I'm now thinking valve systems weren't standardized yet in early 1900s Germany
That would explain the sometimes-odd fingering system on some of these pre-WW2 German/Bohemian/Czech tubas. I have an old pre-WW2 worn-out Bohemian Kaiser BBb tuba with the M3 4th valve (equal to 2&3 combo) instead of the standard P4 (1&3) 4th valve.

^ If you think about it, though, 1st valve being a half-step actually seems more logical, as the length gets longer with each passing valve: 1- 2-- 3--- 4----. Who came up with our standard fingering system anyway?

The designer of the QWERTY keyboard.