so.. I got a trombone.

Lew · Post by **Lew** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 3:46 pm

This is a Conn 'Director' model 14H trombone. The Director line was Conn's student line of instruments from that time. The "K" prefix on the serial number dates it from about 1967. These are probably one of the most common student line trombones made.

Joe's right (as usual?) about the market value in its current condition and about a good mouthpiece to start with.

ThomasDodd · Post by **ThomasDodd** » Mon Dec 20, 2004 4:51 pm

And it is a tenor, not and alto horn.

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 3:07 pm

bloke wrote:Your Dad paid approximately market value. Try a size 6-1/2AL mouthpiece.

Yup. I bought a Director just to get a decent case for my $100 48H. $25 is cheap for a usable case, heh, heh.

The instrument was advertised as in playing condition, but it required at least 15 pounds of force to make the slide move, owing to several substantial kinks. I put it in the pile labeled Soldering Practice.

If the slide works, it's good enough for learning slide technique, and everything I read and hear tells me it's better to learn slide technique on a straight tenor than on a trombone with an F attachment.

Rick "who still hasn't learned slide technique, however" Denney

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 3:47 pm

Rick Denney wrote: Yup. I bought a Director just to get a decent case for my $100 48H. $25 is cheap for a usable case, heh, heh.

Disilllusioned band kids are sometimes a good source for instruments. I have a very clean (with original case) Holton Collegiate tenor bone from 1939 that I paid $100 for. A nice player for a "peashooter". It belonged to said student's grandfather.

Joe Baker · Post by **Joe Baker** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 3:59 pm

Rick Denney wrote: Yup. I bought a Director just to get a decent case for my $100 48H. $25 is cheap for a usable case, heh, heh.
. . .

Rick "who still hasn't learned slide technique, however" Denney

48H?? Didn't you buy an Olds Ambassador? So now you're collecting trombones, too??
_______________________
Joe Baker, who also has not yet mastered slide technique, having played trombone for only 35 years...

Joe Baker · Post by **Joe Baker** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 4:25 pm

Yeah, sure, bloke. And I suppose the Holton was an investment, too?

But I agree he got a steal on the 48H.

BTW, you just RUINED my Christmas, knowing you have a SilverSonic 3B and I don't!!

And you're going to SELL IT?!?:shock:

I gotta talk to Mrs. Claus about getting some new old brass under the tree next year...
______________________________
Joe Baker, whose son has been wreaking havoc on his "portfolio" lately.

Lew · Post by **Lew** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 4:41 pm

bloke wrote:
Joe Baker wrote:BTW, you just RUINED my Christmas, knowing you have a SilverSonic 3B and I don't!! And you're going to SELL IT?!?:shock:

no problem a Capital One card couldn't solve...

Those of us employed by Capital One (meaning me) appreciate the brand recognition.

Joe Baker · Post by **Joe Baker** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 4:42 pm

Man, you are CRUEL!! I'm gonna tell Dave Ramsey on you!!
_______________________________
Joe Baker, who has just about got all the barbarians chased out the door, and has no plans to let any more in.

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 4:49 pm

Joe Baker wrote:48H?? Didn't you buy an Olds Ambassador? So now you're collecting trombones, too??

What, not keeping up?

It was actually only about a month after getting the Olds, when I was visiting another antique store with visiting family. The trombone was there, with a $125 price tag. A few small dents and poor lacquer on the tuning slide, handslide in good shape with no significant plating wear on the socks, nickel bell, also with no dents. I went home to conduct research, discovered that the 48H was pretty highly regarded, and that this one dated from the late 50's, apparently a golden era for Conn trombones. I went back and offered the guy $100, and he took it gratefully. I had the slide redone by the Slide Doctor (a mistake I will not repeat--it's good but not the perfection I was led to expect), and bought the case with trombone filler. My total investment is still under $200.

It's not that I'm interested in collecting trombones, but when they fall into my lap like that, I can hardly resist.

Of course, my arm still doesn't know the positions withing an inch of correct, but at least I can't make a characteristic trombone sound.

Rick "wishing tubas were as cheap to collect" Denney

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 4:53 pm

bloke wrote:lemme know if you need to 2-1/2X that $100 for some Christmas money"

I could be bought, but not that cheap.

Rick "who HAS seen 48H's on ebay...and the prices they attract" Denney

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 5:23 pm

TubaAS wrote:That's the same thing I keep hearing from my trombone playing friends about the Slide Doctor. Very strange.

He's in Atlanta, so you may know him.

The praise of him gushes over Trombone.org to such an extent that I thought it was just THE thing to do. He sent me a wooden box, which was fine--the slide got there and back reasonably quickly and without damage.

But he didn't remove the dings in the crook, or give me an opportunity to pay him to do so, though his descriptions lead me to believe that his objective was to make it like new again, even though that occasionally required more than his flat rate. That didn't really bother me. But there was a very small ding in the upper outer slide from where it had been banged into the side of the bell that he raised but did not completely remove, and I can feel it. It's not much, and the slide works fine, but I was again expecting perfection.

I thought that what he did I could have had done by a local technician for less money. I didn't see any real magic in what he did.

Rick "not angry, but also not impressed" Denney

ThomasDodd · Post by **ThomasDodd** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 5:55 pm

harold wrote: www.oberloh.com then click on "What's New" and then on Trombone Slide SPL

This page has been around for some time too. I do like all the pictures Dan has with his pages.

MartyNeilan · Post by **MartyNeilan** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 10:17 pm

I will post of my experience with the Slide Dr. I went to his house about a year and a half ago, for emergency repairs (my horn was knocked off its stand in a recording studio - since then bought a better stand). He was excellent to deal with, and even saw that my kid was entertained in his basement.

He will get your slide MOVING very fast. It may not look perfect. There may still be dings or wrinkles in it, but it will move great. He is obsessive about the alignment of the parallel tubes, and this does seem to make a big difference. My Getzen slide played faster than when it was new. Also, my university sent him the slide of a Bach that was an absolute dog from the factory, and he got it working just fine. Let me repeat that the slides do not look perfect, but they play smooth and fast. Also, he adds some kind of teflon sealant inside. You have to clean the slide daily for about two weeks to achieve maximum smoothness, it may fell slightly scratchy until then.

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 10:32 pm

Joe Baker wrote:And I suppose the Holton was an investment, too?

Yes, it was.

Rick "who invests heavily in his own enjoyment, for which the Holton was also a steal" Denney

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 10:42 pm

MartyNeilan wrote:...Let me repeat that the slides do not look perfect, but they play smooth and fast...

I have no complaints with the service I received, at any level.

But I can feel that ding on the top slide. It doesn't slow me down (now, there's an absurd statement: NOTHING could worsen the way I move that slide), and my slide will also slide off at a shallow angle. But I still feel it, and I didn't want to feel it.

And, frankly, I'd have been happy without the Teflon goop. Just give it to me clean, and I'll lubricate it. But that was my fault--he told me what he'd be doing, and that was part of it.

On the subject of the dings in the crook, let me say that to perform the sort of alignment he performs requires, by his own description, disassembling the slide. That's the time to remove dings, it seems to me. For me to have those removed at this point would require undoing all that he did. Why pull off a crook and not dedent it? So, I'll live with those small dents--in my case they don't matter anyway.

Rick "who had another offer to perform the repair and regrets not taking it" Denney[/i]

tubatooter1940 · Post by **tubatooter1940** » Tue Dec 21, 2004 10:48 pm

The bar I was playing at burned to the ground and my old Getzen valve bone was gone forever.I went to a music store that advertised a large shipment of used trombones.He had just recieved 60 old horns and refused to tell me which brands were the best so I hung around and tried out all 60 .The salesman was almost crazy by the time I finished but I had to be sure.I selected a Conn slide bone and liked it much better than my old valve bone.I didn't have a stand for it and would lay it on the bandstand behind me when we took breaks.The drummer jumped on it one night and I was boneless until my son quit the high school band because his director was obnoxiously gay and I still have his nice Conn tenor bone.
Still slippin' and slidin',
tubatooter1940

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Wed Dec 22, 2004 12:15 am

tuba4sissies wrote:is there a link or picture to help me perfect my valve positions better?

Since we old people "rample" on, and you young people ask confusing questions, the following may not be what you seek:

First position (slide all the way in) is like no valves on a euphonium or baritone.

Second position is about halfway to the bell edge, and it's like the second valve.

Third position is about at the bell edge (maybe a little short of it), and it's like the first valve.

Fourth position is that same interval out from the bell edge as second position is in from it, and it's like the 1-2 combination (or 3 alone) on a valved instrument.

Fifth position is twice the distance from first position to the bell edge, and it's like the 2-3 combination.

Sixth position is just short of the socks, and it's like the fourth valve.

Seventh position is almost falling off, and it's like the 2-4 combination.

Anything more precise than that requires your ear and many, many hours of practice.

Rick "recalling Bloke's difficulty navigating the slide of a 'soprano' trombone he made, because the bell edge wasn't in the usual spot" Denney

MartyNeilan · Post by **MartyNeilan** » Wed Dec 22, 2004 12:53 am

Rick Denney wrote: On the subject of the dings in the crook, let me say that to perform the sort of alignment he performs requires, by his own description, disassembling the slide.

FWIW, Most of the time I don't think he completely removes the crook. What I have seen him do is heat up the solder on the braces and tweak the tubes, then let the solder cool - keeping them in their new "improved" spot.

Mudman · Post by **Mudman** » Wed Dec 22, 2004 2:55 am

It is all a question of cost. Tweaking the slide without completely taking it apart results in an inexpensive fix. The set price for slide jobs as done by the Slide Dr. is relatively inexpensive.

It is not always pretty, but the slide will move freely.

ThomasDodd · Post by **ThomasDodd** » Wed Dec 22, 2004 10:35 am

tuba4sissies wrote:..i guess you can say trombones are never 'in-tune'?

It's the other way around. Trombone is the only horn with no excuse for being out of tune, since the tuning slide is in your hand and moves easily.

Valves all have tuning problems. like 12, 23 or 13, which do you tune? On which partial? Even the first valve is not in tune on all partials, so you "lip it", pull slides, or use altenate fingerings to get closer. Reeds are worse, you cannot lip it, or pull slides.