Avant Rock

[Dan Schultz]

Used to smoke a bit and listen to this guy in the late 60's.

http://csunix1.lvc.edu/~snyder/em/varese.html

Zappa even liked him

[TMurphy]

I was definitely going to suggest ELP....specifically Toccata, which SplatterTone mentioned (which was actually Emerson's arrangement of the Ginestera piece).

How about also "Welcome to the Machine" from Pink Floyd's "Wish You Were Here" album...come to think of it...all parts of "Shine On You Crazy Diamond" might fit your needs well, as would many of the effects included on Dark Side of the Moon and the Wall.

I know this all falls into the realm of "Main Stream," but I saw no mention of some of this stuff yet.

[ai698]

But what happens if you listen to all these albums backwards?

[SplatterTone]

But what happens if you listen to all these albums backwards?

With the Kraftwerk album, I don't think you would notice anything.

Now, Kraftwerk is exactly the kind of "music" Dieter (Mike Myers) from the Saturday Night Live "Sprockets" skits would love.

[windshieldbug]

How about Sun Ra and his Arkestra(s)?

[dmmorris]

The beach boys used a Theramin

...but "good Vibrations" sure ain't Avant Garde

[kegmcnabb]

The beach boys used a Theramin

...but "good Vibrations" sure ain't Avant Garde

dmmorris,

No it ain't, but it sure is a good example of avant garde techniques (unusual instrumentation) in a mainstream pop song. I have already chosen to cite that as an early example. By the way, is that a "Yellow Shark" in your avatar.

How about Sun Ra and his Arkestra(s)?

Not exactly pop, but I do cite Sun Ra as a major influence on certain rock and pop icons (Beatles, Capt. Beefheart)

Lots of good examples from all. Many I have already, some I don't, but I am still hoping for some more unusual examples from between '65 and '80. Not psychodelia but music that goes even further.

Used to smoke a bit...

Sounds good, but how do ya light 'em up

Seriously though, good suggestion, although I am more interested in what pop/rock artists have done with Varesian ideas than Varese himself. And yeah you're right, Zappa loved him and you can hear it in a great deal of his work.

Thanks for everyone's suggestions.

[SplatterTone]

I had another one of those slap the forehead moments driving to work today. It's strange how the subconscious works.

Necessary listening: The soundtrack for Clockwork Orange.

I don't know how I could have forgotten this. I bought everything that Walter -- Yes, it was still Walter -- Carlos did back then.

[dmmorris]

By the way, is that a "Yellow Shark" in your avatar.

Yeah. I've always been sorta a big fan of FZ's music, and have copies of most of his output on vinyl. The Yellow Shark album w/ Ensemble Moderne has some truely beautiful music on it.....and it is extremely well recorded.........and the "Shark" makes for a honorably cool icon.

[lprince]

1. robert fripp and his "frippertronics"? someone already mentioned adrian belew, but king crimson, specifically those albums done after the 7 year hiatus with tony levin and bill bruford; discipline, beat... they definitely use music concrete (5pts. on music history exam)
although maybe not pop they've all played with more mainstream people (peter Gabriel, talking heads, paul simon, david bowie)

2. Bjork is pretty awesome and was almost mainstream until the swan incident.

3. There are also elements of phasing and sound effects in lots of hip hop and rap . Early ‘beat-box’ stuff up to Outkast, and what about sampling, does that qualify as collage? Does bobby mcferrin count as sound effects?

4. Another cool extension of zappa is little stevie vai’s music, for example passion and warfare uses some cool recording techniques and repeats clips of people saying things.