TubeNet

Okay, we're mostly agreed that the musical instruments sold by Walmart are a net "bad thing" (and those of you who disagree, your existence is also hereby acknowledged).

I'd love to see them quit selling crappy trumpets and clarinets -- goodness knows there are enough crappy trumpets & clarinets in the world now -- but it occurs to me that Walmart could probably make MORE MONEY on LESS SHELFSPACE if, instead of instruments, they carried valve oil, mouthpieces, music books, band shoes, music stands -- all those staples of the local music store, except that for an AWFUL lot of people the local music store is either an hour away, or closes at 5:00, or isn't open weekends....

Ah, but where there IS a local music store, will this cut them off at the knees? Or will it free them from a time-consuming hassle, having to hire someone to run the cash register just to ring up a bottle of valve oil here, a clarinet swab there.... And if it does hurt that business -- well, I don't mean to gloss over the harm to the individual businessman, but a lot of businesses have become obsolete down through the years because someone came out with a better idea -- if it does put some local music stores out of the retail business, how badly does that hurt instrumentalists? Can they meet their retail needs through mail order, conventions and a smaller number of higher-volume instrument sales venues? Will repair facilities be able to operate without the retail portion (or with a much smaller, less competitive retail portion) of the store?

On the whole, then, I put it to the freak jury: would it be a GOOD THING or a BAD THING for musicians if Walmart stocked a couple dozen decent quality band items?
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Joe Baker, who isn't sure he has enough info to vote yet.

I think that it would be nice, and should not be a killer to the local music store.
We have 2 in town here, but if you need "anything tuba" it's a 45 minute drive to Fredericskburg to the nearest store that has it. I also find it interesting that these 2 local stores will refer you to the third rather than offer to get what you are looking for, or try and stock a wider viariety of musical necessities.
Valve oil, music stands, metronomes...check
Tuba music book...what'satuba?

Don't even go looking for a tuba south of DC or north of Richmond (and I don't know about Richmond)

Joe Baker wrote:Ah, but where there IS a local music store, will this cut them off at the knees?

With respect to my friends in the music store biz, this isn't nor should it be a company like Wal-Mart's concern.

My suspicion from reviewing what's available at the local music store is that valve oil and music stands are not real money makers. They don't carry a wide selection, they don't have premium brands (forget finding Hetmans in the local stores), they don't have a good selection of music stands, and so on. They have lots of guitars, bass guitars, amps, keyboards, saxophones, trumpets, clarinets, and flutes, in that order. Around here, they also have a few banjos. They may have a trombone or two. If it isn't a Bach or Conn-Selmer mouthpiece (or knockoff), they won't have it. And they probably won't have it if it isn't a Bach or one of its clones. They will usually only have one tuba mouthpiece in stock, and no euphonium mouthpieces.

I have this feeling Wal-Mart would have the same problems--little selection of valve oil, poorly chosen brands, cheapie wire stands only, and so on. So, if you use Roche-Thomas valve oil, Selmer slide grease, and Hamilton stands, you'd be all set. Forget Hetmans or Slide-O-Mix. But I also have this feeling that almost anything Wal-Mart would put on the shelf other than music supplies would make more money.

I buy what I need at conferences, online, or during occasional visits to Baltimore. I rarely find anything useful at the local music store. I don't even find a really decent selection of bass guitar strings at the local shop that specialized in stringed instruments.

Rick "who thinks specialized stores have forgotten that they are specialized, opening themselves up for attacks from the likes of Wal-Mart" Denney

Rick, I completely agree that the question of what's best for the competition is, rightly, far from Walmart's concern. I was just asking what's best for musicians.

And I agree that the supplies would be second- or third-rate, and the selection poor; but when Johnny mentions the night before contest that he's out of valve oil, or Susie's last reed breaks an hour before the Jr. High band concert, or the local church choir director finds out at 6:00 PM Saturday Evening that the string quintet expects him to provide stands for the group -- it would sure be nice to be able to get SOMETHING, even if it was second rate. And besides, 2/3 of all the musicians out there are kids, who haven't yet developed preferences in these items. And I'd a lot rather have a kid dumping second-choice valve oil on the valve every day rather than playing it dry for a week before Mom has a chance to drive to Bigsville for a bottle of the good stuff.

My question really has to do with whether musicians themselves -- not Walmart, not the music store owners -- would be better served if Walmart sold the twenty or so highest-demand music supplies. The only reason the welfare of the local music store enters into THIS QUESTION is whether it would go away, and how that would affect the individual musician.
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Joe Baker, who assumes in a free country everyone can sell whatever they want to sell.

Doesn't matter. They'll stock what sells.

I wouldn't care one way or the other. I despise Wal-Mart. I wouldn't shop there if they were GIVING away music supplies.

For a metropolitan area of about 250,000 you would think Evansville, Indiana would have a music store that stocks most anything. However, the answer is usually "we can have it here pretty quick"... when in reality what they should be saying is "well keep your order lying around until we can make our minimum". Now... if you need guitar strings and drum heads... you can get those at any one of four or five places in town! I ALWAYS try to buy locally but usually end up going on-line.

What will all the crappy music stores around here sell ? Most of the music stores here in Richmond barely make any money sellng band instruments except for the first three months of the school year . Other than that very few even have a horn in stock. If Walmart takes away their accessory business most will have to fold .

Note: For this post, I group cheap valve oil as well as cheap guitars, cheap keyboards, Titanic soundtrack music, etc. into the category I refer to as "generic stuff." This stuff sells fast and furious. My use of "specialty products" refers to any products (mouthpieces, instruments, oils, greases, etc) that we as "aspiring professionals" may consider adequate for our personal use, these are usually expensive and sell infrequently.

I agree that most smaller music stores are crap. I don't bother to go in them. Nothing that they stock (mouthpieces, valve oil, slide grease, instruments, sheet music, etc) is of any interest to me. All they sell is generic stuff, they aren't specialty stores. They are kind of like a bunch of really small Walmarts.

However, there are some music stores that are ok. Here, in Ontario we have a "Long & McQuade" store in Toronto that stocks some pretty good stuff. They've had in Perantucci PT-606p and PT-6 tubas (among others) as well as decent mouthpieces (ie Perantucci, Schilke, Denis Wick). I'm certain they have other good stuff I don't know about. Sure, buying this stuff from them is expensive (compared to WWBW for example) but it is convenient.

This Long & McQuade store does depend a fair amount on it's generic sales which it still has in addition to the specialty products (ie the B&S stuff). In a way, the store's stocking of specialty products is dependant on their sale of generic stuff. If Walmart were to come in and take away a sizeable portion of those generic sales, Long & McQuade may not be able to afford to sell specialty products, and may go into a pricing war with Walmart, which Long & McQuade will lose.

I guess it is remotely possible it may be a positive thing. I'm not sure exactly of a scenario to suggest my idea, but it's possible that the market share held by the smaller music stores may shift to a place like Long & McQuade when Walmart enters the competition. I guess the scenario might be that Walmart bankrupts the smaller stores, but the people that used to shop there are anti-Walmart so they go to Long & McQuade. However, I would imagine that the anti-Walmart market share they pick up would be less than the market share they would lose to Walmart.

I just want to clarify that I don't think that small music stores shouldn't exist. They provide an important role in the development of musicians. They provide young, inexperienced players with convenient "acceptable" products that aren't too terribly expensive, and they usually know a thing or two about the stuff. Walmart employees would have absolutely no idea what kind of sax reed a 3rd year sax player should be playing on.

I would much rather have my students going to a small crappy music store than Walmart to get the stuff they need. Down with Walmart!

Quinterbourne, unfortunately there is a growing bunch of people who will enter a small shop, get the info they might need and use whatever knowledge they gained to buy at the non-service cheapo place.

I just had a student come in last week with a pack of 10 reeds he got at Walmart. I didn't look at them close enough to see if they were worth anything. he seems to be able to play them OK. i would imagine they are no Vandorens or even rico royals, but if they work, they work.

ken k

...and Sears, at one time, sold clarinets, trumpets, etc. Nothing new in all of this.

http://cgi.ebay.com/VINTAGE-1908-Lamore ... dZViewItem

tubeast wrote:Quinterbourne, unfortunately there is a growing bunch of people who will enter a small shop, get the info they might need and use whatever knowledge they gained to buy at the non-service cheapo place.

And people who will go to a music store (ie Custom Music) to try out (brand new) tubas and mouthpieces with absolutely no intention of purchasing... just to see if they like the kind of instrument/mouthpiece so they may buy one elsewhere (ie used).