TubeNet

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/11844867" target="_blank

very interesting article...

pulseczar wrote:http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/11844867" target="_blank

very interesting article...

Not really...

One, the author's ignorance towards band programs is completely ridiculous. Two, stuff happens in sports. Deal with it. That cart is far enough from the end zone.

That article is very biased and the player seems quite the whiner.

... and you know that "Sooner Schooner"-thing is made of foam, so the all-important players only bounce off.

"The amazing thing is he never takes his eye off the ball. Just like a good receiver."

Just like a good future food-service industry hopeful.

How has the quarterback been exonerated? He overthrew the ball. If he hits the target in the endzone, the receiver catches the ball, scores, and pulls up.
If we're shifting blame to those who shouldn't be blamed, let's not leave out anyone.

TexTuba wrote:

pulseczar wrote:http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/11844867" target="_blank

very interesting article...

Not really...

I had the exact same reaction.

TexTuba wrote: One, the author's ignorance towards band programs is completely ridiculous. Two, stuff happens in sports. Deal with it. That cart is far enough from the end zone.

That article is very biased and the player seems quite the whiner.

I agree 100%. I found a clip of the incident on YouTube. The cart was NOT on the field. The dude ran into the cart. He was 5+ yards out of the end zone. He should have realized the ball was going to be out of bounds and let it go. Even someone as dumb about sports as I am knows that to be a touchdown, one needs to catch the ball in bounds. Saying that "a good receiver never takes his eye off the ball" is colossally stupid. The guy was still sprinting with reckless disdain five yards out of bounds. If that cart hadn't been there, he very well may have run into something else, potentially hurting himself even worse.

This is no different than if I had sprinted down my street blindfolded, then tripped over my neighbor's garbage can, hurt myself, then expect to be able to sue my neighbor. It's preposterous.

I have near zero interest in "ball and stick" sports. Coincidentally, I have zero interest in marching band of any sort. IMHO, marching band is "football band". It seems to exist for the sake of the football team, and is therefore, a complete waste of time.

I sure hope they didn't damage the cart or any equipment in it. That would have been a bummer.
Seriously though, in our pep band, we have gotten many volleyballs hitting our flutists (which is admittedly slightly amusing), once a volleyball hit the top of a sousaphone, and during one game, a basketball player ran into our drum set.
The guy who ran into our group should have been watching, but it is understandable that he could have missed seeing us there if he was looking the other way. But he WAS looking the other way, so he didnt see us. And that sounds like it was his fault. And with the balls that hit our band, we were given warnings to keep an eye out for stuff that might come flying towards us.

Think about this in terms of a car accident. The cart was simply parked and the other guy rammed it full force. That sounds a lot like the accident was his fault (especially if it was parked along the edge).
Then again, if he had hit his head, it may have made him smarter...but we'll never know

On of the things that bugs me about Americans is the insistence that any bad thing that happens must be blamed on someone.

This is a case where everyone was behaving reasonably, but someone got hurt. It's unfortunate, but sometimes bad things happen even when people behave reasonably. Trying to make someone the villain just perpetuates the problem. Taking it to court is one reason why you can't buy a ladder without six feet of warning labels down the legs and without paying extra for the manufacturer's legal defense team.

The rant on band people is just the sort of thing that one would expect from guy who talks about football rather than playing it. Lots of macho and utterly devoid of fact. But that's one reason I'm not a football fan. I can, however, think of a few choice epithets that have been directed by "band geeks" towards jocks.

What would have happened had the football player run into a musician rather than a cart, and caused severe injury (as would be likely)? Would there be a journalist ranting in public about how the football jocks are too stupid not to maintain some situational awareness? Probably not. Would there be a lawyer saying it was a case worth pursuing? Absolutely.

Rick "thinking the football players 'special' potential the least relevant aspect of the story" Denney

cjk wrote:Coincidentally, I have zero interest in marching band of any sort. IMHO, marching band is "football band". It seems to exist for the sake of the football team, and is therefore, a complete waste of time.

I was with you 100% until I got to the statement above. I could not disagree with you more and could spend the next couple of hours stating why that statement is just simply foolish nonsense but I won't. I will say that I can name a good number of VERY successful professionals (one of whom I had lunch with today--he and I "wasted our time in marching band" 30+ years ago) who were in marching band and had a great experience--sorry you missed out on that.

JJ

TUBAD83 wrote:

cjk wrote:Coincidentally, I have zero interest in marching band of any sort. IMHO, marching band is "football band". It seems to exist for the sake of the football team, and is therefore, a complete waste of time.

I was with you 100% until I got to the statement above. I could not disagree with you more and could spend the next couple of hours stating why that statement is just simply foolish nonsense but I won't. I will say that I can name a good number of VERY successful professionals (one of whom I had lunch with today--he and I "wasted our time in marching band" 30+ years ago) who were in marching band and had a great experience--sorry you missed out on that.

JJ

If one actually wants to be a band director or if one actually likes football, I could see how one would enjoy marching band.

Else, I don't much see the point. At the University I attended, it was lots of work for very few credit hours and a tiny scholarship (one could make more money waiting tables with much less hours expended). Most of the folks I know who went on to be professional musicians either HAD TO march to maintain their scholarship, really NEEDED the money, or NEEDED the credits for their Ed degree.

There's also the social aspect of marching band, lots of parties, lots of drinking. The social aspect is much like a fraternity or a sorority. Personally, I've never found being drunk on a bus to be much fun.

Marching band still seems like an activity that is worshiping at the altar of football which is something I choose not to do.

I know you probably disagree, please free to enlighten me about what I missed. I'm genuinely interested.

cjk wrote:Marching band still seems like an activity that is worshiping at the altar of football which is something I choose not to do.

Well, that seems a bit overstated.

There is something to be said for the hard work and dedication of developing a halftime show. Learning to work in a group toward a common goal is a very real benefit of marching band participation. Value is placed on learning to push oneself to always improve and uphold high personal standards. Few other activities are as detail-oriented as marching band, as well.

Whether a band member "likes" football or whether the fans "like" the halftime show really isn't the point at all. Some may participate in marching band simply to "get in to the games," and some might do it "just for the drunken parties"...but many others receive valuable life lessons through participation in it. I know I did.

Todd S. Malicoate wrote: There is something to be said for the hard work and dedication of developing a halftime show. Learning to work in a group toward a common goal is a very real benefit of marching band participation. Value is placed on learning to push oneself to always improve and uphold high personal standards. Few other activities are as detail-oriented as marching band, as well.

Seems a bit overly idealistic, especially since playing printed music is innately detail-oriented. Seems like all of the above benefits can be derived from wind ensemble, orchestra, brass quintet, tuba quartet, or symphonic band without having to go to football games.

cjk wrote: Seems a bit overly idealistic, especially since playing printed music is innately detail-oriented. Seems like all of the above benefits can be derived from wind ensemble, orchestra, brass quintet, tuba quartet, or symphonic band without having to go to football games.

Unless you want more than the parents and friends of the people playing to hear it.

cjk wrote: If one actually wants to be a band director or if one actually likes football, I could see how one would enjoy marching band.

Else, I don't much see the point. At the University I attended, it was lots of work for very few credit hours and a tiny scholarship (one could make more money waiting tables with much less hours expended). Most of the folks I know who went on to be professional musicians either HAD TO march to maintain their scholarship, really NEEDED the money, or NEEDED the credits for their Ed degree.

There's also the social aspect of marching band, lots of parties, lots of drinking. The social aspect is much like a fraternity or a sorority. Personally, I've never found being drunk on a bus to be much fun.

Marching band still seems like an activity that is worshiping at the altar of football which is something I choose not to do.

I know you probably disagree, please free to enlighten me about what I missed. I'm genuinely interested.

Marching band is more than just parties, football games, or a course to take in pursuit of a degree. Its about teamwork--working with others to achieve a goal, that goal being to put on the best show possible, Its about connecting with other people from different neighborhoods, different towns, different cultures even--making connections that could last a lifetime. its about performing--Anyone who has experienced this will tell you that there is NOTHING like marching into your home stadium full of tens of thousands of screaming fans playing the school fight song--it defies description. I truly cherish those memories and the friendships that were formed in my marching band days.

JJ

Here's my only question regarding marching bands in college:

How large do you think the bands would be if:

1. They did not offer a scholarship
2. It was not required for most music majors

We don't quite march, but our pep band plays at womens volleyball games and men's basketball games. We are not paid (except for a trip down to Anaheim for the tournament) and it's not required for music majors (nor is it required that we be music majors). We all just do it because it's fun and we love getting to play with each other (ok, it's also a great way to get in some really loud practice that if no one's paying attention can get distasteful). We all just do it because we want to.

This kid should STFU and deal. The band did him a favor. He wouldn't make it in the NFL, at any position. Instead, because of NCAA stipulations, he gets to finish his education for free. Because he won't be tied to a ridiculous practice schedule, still has access to tutors, and will receive top-class rehab, he will have an even better chance to get a real education and potentially have a better career outside of sports rather than having to replay his glory days.

I have worked with an ex-NFL player, know a kid who played some in the NFL, and these guys are both dealing with significant problems stemming from the physical nature of the sport. Imagine being 50 and having the mobility of a 75 year old. There is a reason the players' unions in the leagues have gotten salaries so high, even at the minimum. The wear and tear of these games is unbelievable.

I feel bad about the pain he has to endure, as I have rehabbed an injury that took 6 months of intensive 3x a week rehab. But the idea that he has to sue someone to make himself "whole" (what the legal system is for) is disgusting. His physical talents got him access to a great chance for an education, and now he can focus even more on becoming a better student and possibly a better person.

Oh, and that Dodd fellow in the original article needs some help. Probably couldn't make it in sports, wasn't good enough for the band, and sucks as a writer. Good for him.

TexTuba wrote:Here's my only question regarding marching bands in college:

How large do you think the bands would be if:

1. They did not offer a scholarship
2. It was not required for most music majors

A good point. Personally, I wish they didn't "encourage" majors to play in marching band in this way. Marching band should be for the folks who enjoy the activity, period.

Also, in my personal opinion, I do acknowledge that the bands would be slightly smaller and perhaps not as "good." My own experience, though, suggests to me that they would be much more fun for those involved. My own recollection is that those majors who didn't want to be there but had to be for degree reasons or a "buck" were an overwhelming majority of the problem-causers. An anecdote, to be sure, but I suspect more people who love the activity will agree with me.

At the very least, it would give music majors who are so "encouraged" to play one less thing to bitch about when the going gets tough.

cjk wrote:Seems like all of the above benefits can be derived from wind ensemble, orchestra, brass quintet, tuba quartet, or symphonic band without having to go to football games.

I don't disagree, to an extent. But your example reminds me of comparing someone who juggles very well to someone who juggles very well while riding a unicycle. Juggling (like performing music) by itself requires dedication and attention to detail, but doing it while riding a unicycle (or playing music while marching) requires an additional set of skills which demand extra attention to detail. That, to me, is part of the appeal of marching band and what helps instill a sense of accomplishment in those who strive to do it well.

TexTuba wrote:Here's my only question regarding marching bands in college:

How large do you think the bands would be if:

1. They did not offer a scholarship
2. It was not required for most music majors

When I was in school at the Univ of Houston there very few band scholarships and marching band was NOT a requirement for music majors (which is still true today)--less than 25% of the 250 member band were music majors. Bottom line, everyone was in marching band because they wanted to be there.

TUBAD83 wrote:

TexTuba wrote:Here's my only question regarding marching bands in college:

How large do you think the bands would be if:

1. They did not offer a scholarship
2. It was not required for most music majors

When I was in school at the Univ of Houston there very few band scholarships and marching band was NOT a requirement for music majors (which is still true today)--less than 25% of the 250 member band were music majors. Bottom line, everyone was in marching band because they wanted to be there.

According to their website, U of H offers grants to EVERY member of the marching band. That raises question one for me.

The word you were looking for is colostomy, not chellostropy. It is neither necessary nor sufficient for one to be "old" to have to use (crap in) one of these. This is a consequence of many ailments of the intestines or colon necessitating a surgical procedure involving the anus. I've even seen and heard of young people being fitted with one of these. Being older (68) I find your rhetoric here a bit callow and insensitive, but that's just an old curmudgeon's opinion.