TubeNet

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 11:36 am**

TexTuba wrote:Hello all. I was watching this special on ABC about UFO's and whether or not people believe there is life elsewhere. So here's my question to fellow Tubenetters: Do you believe there is intelligent life elsewhere?

I sure hope so, because I haven't found very much here.

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:22 pm**

There is. Has to be. Universe is too damn expansive for this measly little planet to be the only bastion of life in it.

To believe that, would be the ultimate in human arrogance.

Do I believe life from other worlds have ever visited ours??? No. If they had, we would have made much greater strides towards our own interstellar travel. Or we'd have been obliterated. Either way.

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:31 pm**

If they had, we would have made much greater strides towards our own interstellar travel.

Not really. Maybe we are just that stupid. For example, If you could go to another planet and the only life you could find were cats, how much time and effort would you spend teaching them how to accomplish interstellar travel? Not much I would guess.

And, they would be of no threat to the home planet so why waste the ammo to kill them (and dont say because it would be fun

)

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:34 pm**

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 12:52 pm**

Could be.

I marvel that, to a lot of people, the existence or nature of God revolves around this question. For example, I know a lot of Christians (I am a Christian myself) who consider it their Christian duty to deny the possibility of life elsewhere, and I sense that many scientists, should they find life elsewhere, would turn to religious folks and say "aha!" For the life of me, I don't understand that.

With that said, as a Christian I don't consider it a given that there's life elsewhere. Since it's my belief (this IS about beliefs, right?) that God created life, and since the Christian Bible, which I believe (there's that word again) to be His word to us, makes no mention of life on other planets, I don't see any reason to believe that life exists there. 'Course the Bible didn't say that there was a peopled land mass between Europe and Asia, either. So it seems foolish to me to assume that God told us everything we'd ever learn -- or even everything we'd ever NEED to learn -- in these writings. Maybe He just taught us those things we couldn't learn in other, natural ways.

Here's another question for you, though. Suppose there IS life out there, with enough sophistication to receive our radio waves and reach us. Why does the SETI crowd assume that life we find and contact would want to be our friends? What makes us think that they wouldn't take a look at earth and say

"mmm, resources", and wipe us all out for those resources? Does it REALLY make sense to go looking for life that's more technologically advanced than we are?
________________________________
Joe Baker, who thinks there could possibly be life out there, but questions the wisdom of looking for it -- but doesn't spend much time worrying about it one way or the other.

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 1:02 pm**

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 2:26 pm**

Forty-two.

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 2:30 pm**

TexTuba wrote:Hello all. I was watching this special on ABC about UFO's and whether or not people believe there is life elsewhere. So here's my question to fellow Tubenetters: Do you believe there is intelligent life elsewhere? Ralph

Absolutely

I knew a girl once who had an *** that was out of this World

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 3:32 pm**

TexTuba wrote:...Do you believe there is intelligent life elsewhere?

Ralph

Life, yes, intelligent, not necessarily.

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:43 pm**

The angels were created slightly above human beings, but we are more important to The Ancient of Days than them. The 2/3 that remain loyal to the Father are also loyal to us.

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 4:57 pm**

cktuba wrote:
Leland wrote:Forty-two.

What is 6x7???

Magnificent!!!

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:27 pm**

Ha! I had better fix that.

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:20 pm**

There are obviously people who not only believe in aliens, but they believe that they created the Earth and everything on it!

http://www.intelligentdesignnetwork.org/

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 7:56 pm**

Lew wrote:There are obviously people who not only believe in aliens, but they believe that they created the Earth and everything on it!

http://www.intelligentdesignnetwork.org/

I almost fit that description, but I believe in only one such "alien" (although He is expressed in three persons).

I assume you intended that as ridicule, but I don't care

(I didn't follow the link; I assume it's a creationist's website, many of which are pretty dreadful). It gave me an opening to say that I believe, by faith, that man was created by God in His image, through WHATEVER mechanism He may have used; and that if life exists elsewhere in the universe, I believe He created it too! 'Course you don't have to believe that. But you make a grave error to assume that everyone who believes in God is a scientific illiterate

.
___________________________
Joe Baker, who knows a lot of IDers get sloppy on the details, but thinks they are on the right track -- and will leave it at that, since these posts are probably history anyway!

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 8:48 pm**

bloke wrote:
since these posts are probably history anyway!
my Chupacabra pic...history?... ...

Say it ain't so, Joe. Say it ain't so!

"It ain't so, Joe."

Lew's post and mine, however.... We'll see!
_______________________________
Joe Baker, who thinks the Chupacabra pic would make a great bell engraving!

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:22 pm**

Joe Baker wrote:
Lew wrote:There are obviously people who not only believe in aliens, but they believe that they created the Earth and everything on it!

http://www.intelligentdesignnetwork.org/
I almost fit that description, but I believe in only one such "alien" (although He is expressed in three persons).

I assume you intended that as ridicule, but I don't care (I didn't follow the link; I assume it's a creationist's website, many of which are pretty dreadful). It gave me an opening to say that I believe, by faith, that man was created by God in His image, through WHATEVER mechanism He may have used; and that if life exists elsewhere in the universe, I believe He created it too! 'Course you don't have to believe that. But you make a grave error to assume that everyone who believes in God is a scientific illiterate .
___________________________
Joe Baker, who knows a lot of IDers get sloppy on the details, but thinks they are on the right track -- and will leave it at that, since these posts are probably history anyway!

I don't "assume that everyone who believes in G-d is illiterate." I do object to people trying to force their religious beliefs on others in a publicly funded institution. Evolution is a theory for which evidence can be gathered and analyzed to try to disprove it, or to try to find alternative theories.

"Intelligent Design" is a way to make creationism sound scientific. There is no way to disprove it, therefore it can't be scientific. I will vigorously defend anyone's right to believe that G-d created "the Heavens and Earth." However, that is a religious belief and its teaching should be confined to non-publically funded settings. I don't want my tax dollars going to teach any religion, mine or yours.

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 9:55 pm**

bloke wrote:
G-d
Someone didn't almost say a "dirty", did they?

bloke "l-fe, g--dness, h-ly,...tee-hee"

Actually, my religious heritage teaches that one never writes out that word completely. It is a matter of respect and to recognize that G-d can never be fully comprehended. In fact, the symbols used to represent his name in our version of the bible are not pronounced as they appear. The mis-interpretation of those symbols is what led to the use of the term "Jehovah." In reality, those symbols don't spell that.

I may not want religion taught in public schools, but that doesn't mean that I don't have some beliefs. They're just not the same as the majority in this country.

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:24 pm**

bloke wrote:
I may not want religion taught in public schools
Why not go the next simple step that will eliminate the whole question, rather than bickering with your cousins, the "conservatives"?

http://www.lp.org/

Are you saying you want religion taught in public schools? How is that religious freedom? Would you want your tax money spent teaching children that Islam is the one true religion? I think not. One should be able to teach ABOUT religion in public schools, just not proselytize. This country was founded on the principle of religious freedom, among others. I, for one, am very happy that it was.

Actually, my beliefs are much closer to those of the Libertarian party than to either of the big parties. I wouldn't go as far as some of their positions, but totally agree with many of them.

Posted: **Mon Feb 28, 2005 10:38 pm**

Doc wrote:
knuxie wrote:I miss Art Bell. He was the best at this kind of discussion.

Ken F.
You need to listen on Saturday night. He's still around.

Lew wrote:
However, that is a religious belief and its teaching should be confined to non-publically funded settings. I don't want my tax dollars going to teach any religion, mine or yours.
Lew,

You and I never get our wires crossed, but I take exception to your statement and your logic. Please take no offense to the following comments.

Teaching about/examining theories and beliefs is not, in and of itself, an attempt at converting the masses at taxpayer expense. That nonsense is the almighty "king's X" that anti-religious folk try to put on any other theory besides evolution. If your going to teach about how the universe/world was created, and if there are other explanations for it besides evolution, then those should be provided for examination. Notice I didn't say for religious conversion. By examining those "other" theories, NO ONE is forcing ANYONE to believe in any "religion". However, when only evolution is taught, and is taught as being the ONLY theory, and that giving credence to any other theory is wrong, we have the exact problem you describe, only in reverse. (Talk about your pot calling the kettle black) The problem you elude to will not occur, unless the curriculum is not delivered properly by the educator. If the teacher turns to preacher, we've got problems, however exposing students to other theories and philosophies for examination violates NOTHING. All the liberals in academia want everyone to have an open mind. Shouldn't they take their own advice?

Let's take this further. Since exposure is off limits, I guess we'd better not expose the children to the Nazis and Hitler, as we'll be forcing the kids to believe in Fascism. We'd better not expose the children to other forms of government, especially communism. We'd have a bunch of little Stalins running around. Can't talk about slavery either. Don't want the slave trade coming back. Better not discuss war. We'll have warring legions to deal with. I guess we had better quit teaching history, government, and social studies. Kids might get too many of the wrong ideas.

Doc

If that were the real belief of this group that would be fine. Unfortunately it's not. It really is about sneaking religious indoctrination into public schools. On the other hand, I fully support examining all possible theories about the origins of the universe or species. Inconsistencies, gaps, unexplained issues should certainly be explored in any theory. Intelligent Design is just bad science. Science requires that a theory be refutable for it to be scientific. If there is no way to evaluate the veracity of a theory, it shouldn't be taught as science.

There is a major difference between teaching about something and teaching that something is right. I never said that we shouldn't expose our children to different ideas. I support teaching children about different religious beliefs, even in public schools. It just shouldn't be taught as science. I have heard too many arguments from the right that we need to teach religious beliefs to reduce crime and create more respectful children. Here in Virginia there are still bible classes in some public schools, although taught by outside groups and children can opt out of them. These are clearly designed not to merely inform but to proselytize.

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