Copyrights and TubeNet

Feedback or suggestions. Be kind. Admin has final decision for any/all removed posts.
Forum rules
Feedback or suggestions. Be kind. Admin has final decision for any/all removed posts.
User avatar
Untersatz
4 valves
4 valves
Posts: 657
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:52 pm
Location: California

Re: Copyrights and TubeNet

Post by Untersatz »

hup_d_dup wrote:Asking a second party for a replacement pdf, regardless of why it needs to be replaced, is a clear violation. The principle here is that any permitted copy must be made by and for the owner of an extant original. Additionally, if an owner sells or gives away an original, he loses the right to use any copy he made.
Let's suppose that you ARE the legal owner of a particular piece of sheet music & the
sheet music gets damaged or lost. You are saying that the music must be purchased
again & a copy cannot be obtained from another person who has this said piece of music?
King 2341 (New Style)
B&S PT-600 (GR55) BBb
Blokepiece "Symphony"
User avatar
Dan Schultz
TubaTinker
TubaTinker
Posts: 10424
Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Newburgh, Indiana
Contact:

Re: Copyrights and TubeNet

Post by Dan Schultz »

TubaMusikMann wrote:
hup_d_dup wrote:Asking a second party for a replacement pdf, regardless of why it needs to be replaced, is a clear violation. The principle here is that any permitted copy must be made by and for the owner of an extant original. Additionally, if an owner sells or gives away an original, he loses the right to use any copy he made.
Let's suppose that you ARE the legal owner of a particular piece of sheet music & the
sheet music gets damaged or lost. You are saying that the music must be purchased
again & a copy cannot be obtained from another person who has this said piece of music?
I understand this as correct.
Dan Schultz
"The Village Tinker"
http://www.thevillagetinker.com" target="_blank
Current 'stable'... Rudolf Meinl 5/4, Marzan (by Willson) euph, King 2341, Alphorn, and other strange stuff.
User avatar
Untersatz
4 valves
4 valves
Posts: 657
Joined: Mon Jan 07, 2013 3:52 pm
Location: California

Re: Copyrights and TubeNet

Post by Untersatz »

I suppose it's the same as people copying VHS cassette tapes, CDs & DVDs....
Good thing nobody does that! :lol:
King 2341 (New Style)
B&S PT-600 (GR55) BBb
Blokepiece "Symphony"
hup_d_dup
4 valves
4 valves
Posts: 843
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2011 9:10 am
Location: Tewksbury, NJ

Re: Copyrights and TubeNet

Post by hup_d_dup »

TubaMusikMann wrote: Let's suppose that you ARE the legal owner of a particular piece of sheet music & the
sheet music gets damaged or lost. You are saying that the music must be purchased
again & a copy cannot be obtained from another person who has this said piece of music?
These are the options as I understand them: 1. The sheet music could be borrowed. 2. An original could be purchased.

There is another possible option (this is speculation on my part) that could be considered a fair use, and that would be to transcribe the part from the score. This could be reasonably be considered a replacement original rather than a copy.

Hup
Do you really need Facebook?
User avatar
ghmerrill
4 valves
4 valves
Posts: 653
Joined: Sat Mar 05, 2011 7:48 am
Location: Central North Carolina

Re: Copyrights and TubeNet

Post by ghmerrill »

Hup's postings are both informative and, I believe, correct. I have only one question (since I don't know and haven't looked into the answer to this myself):
It was recognized that as a practical matter buyers would need, and were permitted, to immediately create backup copies to protect against disc failure or file corruption.
When you say "It was recognized ... and were permitted ...", is this a matter now of copyright law -- so that it covers ALL cases of copying for such uses? -- or is this an explicit right that a particular publisher may grant to the purchaser (and hence some publishers may grant it and some not)?
Gary Merrill

Wessex EEb tuba (Wick 3XL)
Amati oval euph (DE LN106J6Es)
Mack Brass euph (DE LN106J9)
Buescher 1924 Eb, std rcvr, Kelly 25
Schiller bass trombone (DE LB/J/J9/Lexan 110, Brass Ark MV50R)
Olds '47 Standard trombone (mod. Kelly 12c)
hup_d_dup
4 valves
4 valves
Posts: 843
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2011 9:10 am
Location: Tewksbury, NJ

Re: Copyrights and TubeNet

Post by hup_d_dup »

As a point of background information I will mention that I am a retired commercial photographer, so I have followed copyright evolution for several decades. I am not a copyright expert, and my primary knowledge is of copyright as it relates to images, not music. However, copyright practice across various media needs to be logically consistent to be effective, so practice in one area will influence others.
ghmerrill wrote:
It was recognized that as a practical matter buyers would need, and were permitted, to immediately create backup copies to protect against disc failure or file corruption.
When you say "It was recognized ... and were permitted ...", is this a matter now of copyright law -- so that it covers ALL cases of copying for such uses? -- or is this an explicit right that a particular publisher may grant to the purchaser (and hence some publishers may grant it and some not)?
I believe this began as a market force, not a copyright issue. Sometime in the 90's (perhaps earlier) software customers demanded assurance that they would not lose their investment due to unstable software or computers, and suppliers complied to avoid loss of sales or market share.

However, common practice is one of the ways that copyright practice evolves. Due to previous common industry practice — and the lobbying that goes with it — there are references to legitimate copying of software to protect against loss of originals in the Digital Copyright Millennium Act of 1998.

As to your specific question — "is this a matter now of copyright law -- so that it covers ALL cases of copying for such uses?" — I would say no. The issue of copying sheet music we are discussing would be, if it were to be decided in a court, a fair use issue; similar accepted practice in a different area could be a guide but perhaps not a determinant.

Here is what the statute says about fair use:

In determining whether the use made of a work in any particular case is a fair use the factors to be considered shall include—

(1) the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of a commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes;

(2) the nature of the copyrighted work;

(3) the amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and

(4) the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work.


You can see from the above that ultimately a lot of subjective thinking goes into applying these four points. Practice and case law have helped to crystalize these factors but there will always be new situations that fall into grey areas.

When you hear the real experts talking about this they always hedge when asked about a new issue.

Hup
Do you really need Facebook?
Post Reply