Vaughan Williams

brianf · Post by **brianf** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 2:51 pm

When the VW first came out in 1954, someone wrote that it proved even RVW had a bad day. Is it the worse piece - no way!

In an orchestra I play in there is a concert of basically marches - Verdi Aida, 1812 and Beethoven's Wellington's Victory. Not only does that prove even Beethoven had a bad day, it is probably the worse orchestral piece ever. Luckily there is no tuba part.

Arkietuba · Post by **Arkietuba** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 2:51 pm

First of all Robert W. Smith's music is all the same...It's fun to play but is no different than most other composers today. It's just not that great. Vaughan Williams is a genius and the Concerto is by far one of the best concertos ever written for any instrument. I just hope that you're kidding b/c if you're not...then something is wrong.

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 3:10 pm

Arkietuba wrote:I just hope that you're kidding b/c if you're not...then something is wrong.

Please don't feed the trolls.

Rick "who thinks the RVW Tuba Concerto would sound pretty good on a bassoon" Denney

dtemp · Post by **dtemp** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 5:49 pm

It's like I just walked in to my old high school all over again...

There seems to be more nerds though...

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Wed Mar 08, 2006 7:01 pm

Doc wrote:
Rick Denney wrote:Rick "who thinks the RVW Tuba Concerto would sound pretty good on a bassoon" Denney
I enjoy playing it, I enjoyed performing it, but you might be on to something here, Rick. I can definitely hear it.
Doc

Doesn't work. No matter how I'd hit that bassoon, I'd only get a "thunk", and never any defined pitches...

Alex Reeder · Post by **Alex Reeder** » Thu Mar 09, 2006 1:19 am

the Concerto is by far one of the best concertos ever written for any instrument.

Now, I think Diek01 was a little extreme at first, but this is even more ridiculous! Have you even listened to other concertos?????????????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Alex Reeder · Post by **Alex Reeder** » Thu Mar 09, 2006 1:49 am

Cowboy BOB wrote:I've loved the VW ever since i started playing it in the good ole 8th grade

Dude, I started playing the Vawn- Williams when I was in 5th grade! You must have really sucked!

Thomas Maurice Booth · Thu Mar 09, 2006 9:32 am

[quote="yourmomplaystuba"]i bet your tuba only has 4 valves!!
i just added a sixth to mine!!!! :shock: :!:[/quote]

Sounds like you're just trying to compensate for some other things...

Albertibass · Post by **Albertibass** » Thu Mar 09, 2006 8:22 pm

yeah, definatley not cool. I like VW, but even if you don't like how it sounds, give the man credit. People saw a tuba solo as a joke when he wrote it.

Your mom likes vaughn williams.

windshieldbug · Post by **windshieldbug** » Mon Apr 17, 2006 6:11 pm

Hey kids... Eat me!

LoyalTubist · Post by **LoyalTubist** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 7:11 am

bloke wrote:three reasons to play the RVW Concerto (in order of importance):

1/ get paid to play it

2/ play it with your local community band / community orchestra to advertise yourself and drum up more private lessons students

3/ play it well enough to get past the prelims in a round of auditions

4/ chairman of the music dept./dean of the music school tells you that you will play it

MartyNeilan · Post by **MartyNeilan** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 10:21 am

One thing to keep in perspective about the VW concerto.
Many serious tuba players are sick to death of it and some may even think of it as an inferior work (myself excluded) but how many non-tuba-geeks will hear it more than once or twice in their entire lives??

Chuck(G) · Post by **Chuck(G)** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 12:31 pm

Albertibass wrote:yeah, definatley not cool. I like VW, but even if you don't like how it sounds, give the man credit. People saw a tuba solo as a joke when he wrote it.

Judging from some of RVW's comments in his letters, I've often wondered if he didn't think it was a joke.

Rick Denney · Post by **Rick Denney** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 1:09 pm

Chuck(G) wrote:
Albertibass wrote:yeah, definatley not cool. I like VW, but even if you don't like how it sounds, give the man credit. People saw a tuba solo as a joke when he wrote it.
Judging from some of RVW's comments in his letters, I've often wondered if he didn't think it was a joke.

It's hard to say with him. He made jokes about all his works, and more of them about the works about which he was, deep down, most serious. His self-deprecating humor has too often been used to justify deprecation by others.

But it is clear to me that he intended at least parts of the performance to be humorous, and his music is not served if it is taken too seriously. Few of the recordings I have heard have really revealed that humorous aspect, which tells me we still have not heard the definitive performance of it. Too many are too beautiful, and the ones that aren't beautiful are too often so without purpose. Surprisingly, the much-questioned recording by Bill Bell that was made available recently, and which was probably the first public performance in the U.S., revealed that humor in ways the premiere did not.

It's axiomatic that critics take everything too seriously, and seem to praise most those composers who do likewise. After all, good music can only come from a tortured soul, right?

Rick "who thinks Vaughan Williams was not neurotic enough to be well-respected in the 20th century" Denney

MartyNeilan · Post by **MartyNeilan** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:10 pm

Rick Denney wrote: Rick "who thinks Vaughan Williams was not neurotic enough to be well-respected in the 20th century" Denney

Interesting point - imagine if Gus Mahler had whipped up a tuba sonata?

LoyalTubist · Post by **LoyalTubist** » Tue Apr 18, 2006 3:18 pm

valtuba wrote: The first reason for me it's simply because this concerto is wonderful.

I didn't say I didn't like it. But I never had any say on this piece when I did it. When I got into the school's B.M. performance program, the music dept. chairman said he wanted to hear the Vaughan Williams Concerto in one of my mandatory recitals (junior or senior recital). When my junior recital was scheduled to coincide with his sabbatical, I cringed, "Oh, no! I'm going to have to do this again!" (even before I started preparing for it.) When he came back the following year, yes, I had to do it again. I had a different accompanist and it didn't go as well, but I did it.

Maybe the best way to describe my attitude is a child who is being told to do something he wants to do but doesn't like being told to do it.

LoyalTubist · Post by **LoyalTubist** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 5:43 am

Wow, you know we have never met and I own a tuba that David Pack used to own and my first tuba teacher was Gene Pokorny, when he was a student at the University of Redlands (before he transferred to USC).

The research I did on the Vaughan Williams Concerto proved that VW did, indeed, think of the work as a humorous piece. He had previously used the theme of the second movement for a harmonica number written for Larry Adler. I also found some mistakes in the notes on the printed part--maybe in time, these have been corrected. Those note changes worked.

Philip Catelinet, for whom the piece was written, was also very scared about performing the piece. Time magazine gave him a fair review. Mr. Catelinet was just happy to get through the piece. I think he knew what a legacy this piece was going to be.

LoyalTubist · Post by **LoyalTubist** » Wed Apr 19, 2006 6:33 pm

No, the tuba was damaged when I got it.

The tuba got the ball-and-socket linkages when they were introduced. So you won't recognize it.