Finally a 3D picture of CC-291B Bruckner

[cdatuba]

Take a look at:
miraphone.de
Coments?

[jonesbrass]

Pics are very cool, but I'll reserve judgement until I get to play one . . .

[Wyvern]

Nice to see they have had the good sense to put the main tuning slide water key on the bottom, rather than side as is usually the case.

May be in actual fact be bigger, but from the pictures it rather reminds me of the B&S PT-20 even down to the position of the 4th valve slide.

[jeopardymaster]

At first I thought that slide tucked in the back belongs to the 4th valve. Maybe it does, but the slide in front farthest from the receiver is a 4th valve slide (too) right? The image moves too fast for me to distinguish.

[Wyvern]

Both side captured by screen print

[imperialbari]

Nice to see they have had the good sense to put the main tuning slide water key on the bottom, rather than side as is usually the case.

From a user’s point of view I agree with you. However there may be a very good reason for the traditional placement on rotary tubas out of the German/Czech tradition. These instruments often are made out of thin metal. On the outside of bows the metal is even thinner due to the stretching during the bending process. Seating water keys on the bow ferrules may will not challenge that thin bow metal.

Klaus

[timdicarlo]

So has anybody tried one of these?

[UTSAtuba]

Bump...anyone give this a whirl?

[bort]

I *think* it will make it's debut at Frankfurt Musikmesse.

That looks awesome, and it is definitely a rotary 1291. I'm not sure if I'm more excited for this or for the reworked 190. Someone will have to try these out and let us know!

[Wyvern]

There is at least one problem with the design..... The third valve tubing has a upper and lower 'bow', the lower bow is below the level of the valve, and will undoubtedly collect water. It has no spit valve, and spinning the horn to get the water out of the slide, which is on the back side of the tuba, will be a challenge....

That is another feature exactly the same as the B&S PT-20, but I do not remember having had too much trouble with water collection all the same when I had one of those.

[chhite]

I got to spend about ten minutes with this horn today. Ergonomically, everything fit well from the player's perspective and all the slides were easily reachable and moveable. I didn't notice any trouble spots that might collect water quickly, but I did only have a few minutes with it. There were two examples at the Musikmesse, one lacquer and one silver plate. I played the silver one.

Before I describe how it played, I'll first give the conditions under which I was able to test the horn. I was in a small test room(5'x7') with flimsy walls that vibrated while I played. I used a Stofer-Geib mouthpiece, my normal player. For more points of reference, I currently play a Rudolf Meinl 4/4 CC and I have previously owned a Miraphone 188 and 186BBb. Each note slotted very well and the scale felt in tune(I didn't have a tuner with me). There were no partials that seemed out of character on any valve combination. Timbre was typical Miraphone, for my ears, but that is a pleasing sound to me. The volume and character of sound produced would fit nicely as a quintet horn or small to mid-size ensemble horn. The sound blossomed in the mid to upper range but below Great C seemed "tight" and barked a bit when pushed, sort of like a 186. If I can recall properly, my 188 could handle more in that same range and my Rudi definitely produces a broader sound and doesn't break up.

I regret I only had a short time with the horn as I might have been able to better find an approach that made the horn sing in all registers. I'm also relating my brief experience to what I'm accustomed and how I hear myself in a variety of ensembles. The "Bruckner" is fine instrument and is worth a play-test when you get a chance. It might just be what you're looking for.

FWIW, I also tested the re-released Besson 995 CC and that was a great player. One of the differences about this year's Messe was the lack of play-test rooms at some of the vendors which relegated us to testing in the main display area amid all the foot traffic. From what I could gather, the Besson is greatly improved and would be a good investment. Try this one, too.

I don't know if the new Meinl Weston piston Fafner has made it to the States yet, but it will soon. I did not get a chance to play this but, physically, it looked like a B&S PT6P with some added tubing. Shocking...I know.

Another instrument that I have not seen before, and didn't get to play, was a HIrsbrunner compensating 4-piston F tuba. Peter was not at the show and it seems that his shop is experiencing hard financial times, as are many manufacturers.

If it seems I didn't play much today, you're correct. I had only two hours to make my rounds. Not enough time to do an in-depth test on anything, but maybe it's something to chew on for somebody.

[Matt G]

... Meinl Weston piston Fafner...

Somewhere, BBb players are quietly evaluating their current tuba inventory.

http://www.melton.de/index.php?id=115&iid=427&L=1

[chhite]

I'll ask a friend to snap a picture of that tomorrow.

[oedipoes]

I'll ask a friend to snap a picture of that tomorrow.

Yes please, I'm very much interested in that one!
It seemed not ok that a fafner did not get a 5th valve.
I'm not much of a slide-puller, so I like that extra valve on a BBb. There is definitely no reason why a BBb should not have 5 valves, while a CC does.

Only strange that there is no 5-valve rotary version... although competition has it: Miraphone 191.

Wim (could not make it to the Messe after all.

[bort]

Did they have any of the new Miraphone 190s there?

[Kevin Hendrick]

Another instrument that I have not seen before, and didn't get to play, was a HIrsbrunner compensating 4-piston F tuba.

That sounds interesting! Didn't find anything about it on the Hirsbrunner website -- any other information available?

[chhite]

Mark Carter at Mr. Tuba would be the best to ask that question. It was residing at his booth.

[Kevin Hendrick]

Mark Carter at Mr. Tuba would be the best to ask that question. It was residing at his booth.

Thanks for the tip! If I could get there, I'd ask him in person -- will check his website.

[Wyvern]

It seemed not ok that a fafner did not get a 5th valve.
I'm not much of a slide-puller, so I like that extra valve on a BBb. There is definitely no reason why a BBb should not have 5 valves, while a CC does.

Only strange that there is no 5-valve rotary version... although competition has it: Miraphone 191.

Wim, Although not listed as a version, 5 valve rotary Fafner are available to order. Apparently the 5th valve is a dependant valve meaning it is set in the 4th valve loop, so only works in combination with the 4th valve. They decided on that layout to avoid spoiling the Fafner's response in the higher register. Speak to Mark Carter at http://www.MrTuba.com" target="_blank who knows all about it. He has supplier a few 5 valve Fafner to brass bands.

[Ferguson]

At Musikmesse.

Played 291.

Want.

Silver.


No 190 here, will debut at SWRTEC, late May.

Best,

Ferguson