Vaughan-Williams question

[Wyvern]

How much dreadful music did he write that we have never heard?

It is worth looking at RVW Society website for a list of his works. Considering his other solo works, there are several I have never heard.
http://www.rvwsociety.com/worksconcerto.html
If they are better, or worst than 'our' concerto I don't know???

[Rick Denney]

What *is* "characteristic" for us...?? Smatterings of loud two-beat-long farts mixed in with bits-and-pieces of Bb/Eb scales that don't cross any partials...??

If I could answer that, I would solve the problem by writing it. So would you. For all the artistry of our best soloists, they are still trying to persuade people that the tuba can be something it isn't by playing music written for other instruments. Do those works sound better than on the original instruments? Uh, no. They may sound fantastic, but any non-tuba-player listening would probably rather hear it on the original instrument, at least after the novelty of hearing it done surprisingly well on tuba.

What we are waiting for is the work that when you hear it, you think it just wouldn't sound right on any other instrument. Can you imagine the Strauss Horn Concerto played on, say, 'cello? No way. Trumpet would be better, but it still just sounds right on horn.

Rick "who'll know it when he hears it" Denney

[jeopardymaster]

I think his 5th Symphony is his worst.

CUZ HE DIDN'T WRITE A TUBA PART FOR IT!!!!!

He dissed us more than a few times - the Serenade to Music perhaps chief among them - but not inviting us to play on the 5th flat-out sucks.

[ZNC Dandy]

Let's go through and list these that we regularly hear played on our "classy music" radio stations...
- double bass concerti

I'm actually playing the Bottesini Concerto No.2 today on my "classy" radio station. That would be a blast on tuba!

[eupher61]

Several tuba players have performed the Strauss Horn Concerto, and that work, to me, has the brass grandeur lacking in the RVW. It works very well on tuba. But it works even better on horn.

Personally, I think the Strauss 1 is more characteristic of tuba, as it is played today, than of horn, as it is played today. There's so much grandeur in the melodic material that it needs the breadth of tone that can't be had in a pea-shooter bored instrument.

[Rick Denney]

I think his 5th Symphony is his worst.

CUZ HE DIDN'T WRITE A TUBA PART FOR IT!!!!!

He was giving us a rest after the Fourth, which, in the words of one pro, could be the hardest orchestral tuba part in the repertoire.

Rick "wondering how RVW might have composed had he experienced a large contrabass sound" Denney

[Todd S. Malicoate]

I'll put forth the idea that the Concerto is much better when played as intended...with orchestra! The piano reduction is one of the worst ever and just doesn't convey the depth of the piece well at all...especially in the outer movements.

Todd S. "accompanying a senior tuba student for this piece again this semester" Malicoate

[tubashaman2]

.

[Jeff Anderson]

http://www.sfsymphony.org/season/Event. ... ntid=27352

Hear RVW #4 live this week. Great piece.

JA

[Todd S. Malicoate]

Todd, that piano part is insanely difficult! Good luck

Thanks for the kind words...fortunately, I excel at the art of "reduction."

[Wyvern]

I'll put forth the idea that the Concerto is much better when played as intended...with orchestra! The piano reduction is one of the worst ever and just doesn't convey the depth of the piece well at all...especially in the outer movements.

Having played with both piano and orchestra, I would entirely agree! It really needs the lush strings to convey in full.

[Rick Denney]

Six is tricky..... Four is HARD HARD... Oh, and at one point everything stops and the tuba plays a huge exposed solo that hops all over the horn....

That not nearly the hardest part of that work. That's just one of the most satisfying spots.

The hard parts are all those smeared-together (but not slurred) tiny notes that start in all odd relationships to the beat, are filled with accidentals, and require one to double-tongue significantly faster than I can. There are bits in there that are as technical as anything I've ever seen in an orchestra work.

I've heard the work played live where the tuba player used a BAT, and I've heard it played on an EEb. The former had some bottom to the brassy bits that the latter lacked, despite brilliant playing. So, it has extremely technical parts that must be played cleanly, and on an instrument known for the quality of its whole notes.

As to playing anything by RVW in piano reduction, I would agree that the essence of his characteristic sound is as much his orchestration as his harmonic structure and melody, and both are equally critical aspects. Playing it on piano leaves half of the composer out of the result, and certainly all the parts he learned from Ravel. And being non-pianistic was favorable to him--he did not enjoy the piano and felt like he never could play it at all, but that the viola was his musical salvation.

I'd be willing to bet that a more credible accompaniment for the Concerto could be performed on keyboard instrument than on piano, using non-percussive sounds.

Rick "if you play the Sixth, bring a book for the last 20 minutes, but you won't need it; that extended pianissimo is too compelling" Denney