Leadpipe Replacement

[Thomas Maurice Booth]

I have already been in contact with the leadpipe (and horn) manufacturer about purchasing a new leadpipe. However, in his response he told me that the leadpipe will come "straight and rough". I just want to clarify how I should go about replacing my current leadpipe. I have a very competent repairman who should have no trouble bending the lead pipe to fit the horn.

My biggest question is in regards to getting the leadpipe silver plated to match the horn. How does this process work? Do I need to have the leadpipe bent then sent for plating then permanently installed or can it be plated then bent and installed? How long does it usually take to receive something back from the platers?

Any guidance is appreciated!

TMB

[DavidK]

1. Have all of the bending, cutting, fitting and play testing done first.
When you are satisfied with the instrument's intonation and blowing/response characteristics and the mouthpiece location/your playing position.
Then...decide if you even want to pay and wait to have the parts plated.

2. Get the lead pipe, receiver and any braces or parts silver plated
3. Re-assemble

Good luck. Post pictures of the final product.

[hbcrandy]

When your repair-person gets the lead pipe, they will anneal it to soften the metal for bending. The pipe will then be filled with either pitch or lead to keep it from crimping during the bending process. Your old lead pipe will be removed and used to make a pattern for the bending of the new one. The new lead pipe will be bent using the pattern and the pitch or lead will be removed. The pipe will then be buffed and degreased. It is, at this point, the pipe can be silver-plated if desired.

There are several options for places to send the pipe for plating. Anderson plating in Elkhart Indiana does superb work, but, depending on the time of year and their workload, can take as much as six weeks. My personal favorite place is Brass Lab, run by Chuck McAlexander in New York City. Chuck does great work and can probably give you a quicker turn-around time.

Once the pipe has been plated, it then is installed on your tuba.

[scottw]

Just as another option, you might want to consider a nickel silver leadpipe. There would be a few advantages:
*It won't rot out
*It is already silver and you needn't plate it [albeit, not so shiny as your horn]
*There wouldn't be a lag in sending it out for re-plating.
*Even as it is more costly to purchase, the cost may even out w/o the plating price.

[iiipopes]

Just as another option, you might want to consider a nickel silver leadpipe. There would be a few advantages:
*It won't rot out
*It is already silver and you needn't plate it [albeit, not so shiny as your horn]
*There wouldn't be a lag in sending it out for re-plating.
*Even as it is more costly to purchase, the cost may even out w/o the plating price.

Hmm. It is rare, but I am one of the few individuals whose body chemistry is reactive to nickel (I corrode it completely away) and inert to silver.

Also, the "cast" of reflection off silverplate and nickel plate can vary and be noticeable under the right circumstances.

But it is a viable option in some circumstances.

[Thomas Maurice Booth]

After talking with my repairman further, he will be able to take care of all the necessary items, including in-house silver plating!!!!! The only condition is that the lead pipe comes filled with either pitch or cerrobend so that the metal is not destroyed by kinking during the bending process.

I have emailed the manufacturer to make sure that they ship the lead pipe filled so that everything can be taken care of in as quick a manner as possible. I have yet to hear back from them, but I do not anticipate this being an issue.

Thanks for the advice so far! I will keep you updated as the process continues.

TMB

[Lee Stofer]

Some European manufacturers still fill the pipe with lead, which is my preferred working method. Pitch has a more narrow band of temperature in which it will work well.

[dave]

they will anneal it to soften the metal for bending. The pipe will then be filled with either pitch or lead to keep it from crimping during the bending process. Your old lead pipe will be removed and used to make a pattern for the bending of the new one. The new lead pipe will be bent using the pattern and the pitch or lead will be removed.

Being a do-it-yourself kind of person, I am about to bend a leadpipe, for the first time. My Alex 151 came with two leadpipes, and my Alex 150 has a badly damaged leadpipe (and the orig. had an intermediate sized receiver, while the 151 receiver takes large shank mouthpieces), so I plan to adapt the extra 151 leadpipe to use on the 150.

Randy, your post provided some new info. Good thing I didn't do the work today as I had planned. I have some lead fishing weights I can melt so I will use lead, but I had not planned on annealing the leadpipe first. I also had not planned on making a pattern - I was going to do it by eye (using the existing leadpipe as a guide), with the help of some rounds of various diameter and some jigs I can make on the metal lathe as needed. What do the patterns look like that you mention? I'm having trouble visualizing a single pattern since a leadpipe bends in so many different directions/planes. When the leadpipe is done, will the lead leave any lead plating behind inside the leadpipe, or is there something I need to do other than just heat it and let it run out to end up with a nice clean interior?

Also, will the bending work harden the leadpipe sufficiently, or will it remain soft due to the annealing?

-Dave

[DavidK]

You may find other pre-filling materials that are easier to work with. Like Cerrobend or some other product that can be removed in boiling water. Less toxic than lead. If you go the lead route - handle it appropriately. Then you'll be able to reuse or recast it and have the most musical fishing weights in the county!

After you do all your bending, then getting the bent tube back into a round cross section along its entire length is another task. Running dent balls through any small wrinkles. Pounding the outside with "rounding rings" or dies. Check the Oberloh website galleries - or the Holton 345 project thread here on tubenet. Somewhere in there is the section on reworking a lead pipe. You'll see the ring/dies and burnishing steps in action working on the outside contour of the bent pipe. Use lots of grease or oil with any of these finishing operations - reduce the risk of gouging the metal, inside and out. Less sanding and polishing afterwards as you prep for the plating.

After all that you may have to re-adjust the bends and fit again. Then repeat any smoothing operations.

All this metal working and re-working may require multiple annealing sessions.

For me? I leave this one up to the pros - they already have the tools and skills. But I'd love to sit in and watch!

Good luck!

[imperialbari]

If I had to go through a leadpipe-replacement-process, I would clamp on the leadpipe, so that an easy exchange would be easy.

I am fully aware, that people having this option on one or more of their tubas tend to use the same leadpipe all the time, but then they have had the change to find their preferred leadpipe by a selection process.

Klaus

[dave]

Klaus, the leadpipe on the 151 is the clamp-on type. The reason for having two leadpipes is that it was setup for two different heights. So In addition to extra leadpipe I have some extra bits of hardware that I can transfer to the 150.

DavidK, good advise. I will try and avoid bends that will deform the circular cross section, by making some circular mandrels that have a round trough of the right diameter. I have some eutectic alloys I could use (ingots), and that is something I had considered. No plating is required, it will be left bare or lacquered, since it is gold brass. I will take some pictures.

-Dave