Death of the American CC tuba

[Ken Herrick]

Don't get me wrong; they are nice chop jobs. But thery were not ground-up designs, and thus not really worth the money they eventually charged. Too bad - they once had true CCs in the King rotary. Now the closest you'll find is the MW Bill Bell model (if it's still made).

J.c.S.

Problem is these damned kids today won't buy something unless it has four piston valves, a thumb operated flat-whole step rotary valve, a .750" bore and a "York-style" lead pipe. Because it's THOSE things that make you good enough to win an audition.

RC

The "Flavor of the Month" does seem to prevail when it comes to equipment selection. We have had the great CC vs BBb "debate" the bass vs contra argument, the piston vs rotor, "German" vs "American" sound etc. spats with a seeming loss of the idea that the real bottom line is making good "MUSIC"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Output will only ever be as good as the input and good input is dependent on developing good concepts based on observation and comparison then practice.

There are probably at least 50 "good" models of instruments available to players now which were not around when I was say 20 to 30 years old, most all of which I will never have an opportunity to even see, let alone get to play long enough to beome familiar and comfortable with. However, because I spent the time and effort (aided by fine teachers) many years ago, I was recently able to pick up an instrument and straight away produce a better sound than its owner - a pretty reasonable player - after not even touching a tuba for over 6 years.

Conclusion???????? Shut off the damned computer and go practice.

Oh yes, those old King rotary CCs were nice and I never felt the MW Bell model were as good. At least with the MW with the fifth valve somebody might accept you as a "pro" today. Poor old Bill just never would have made it if he had to play an audition today 'cause he didn't have the right gear............. WHAT?????????????

[Timswisstuba]

They are basically King 2341 BBbs with a Dillon-style chop job.

The original prototype done for Conn by Matt Walters at Dillon Music and what Conn pieced together out of their parts bins to save money by not spending any money on tooling were SIGNIFICANTLY different. Conn cheated the design left and right, up and down...

What Conn sold was a hatchet job...

I agree here. Conn took a lot of shortcuts on the production model. However, I had the 56J prototype that Matt made and it was EXCELLENT IN EVERY WAY. (Sound, intonation , etc..) I had the prototype for 2 weeks so I had time to really get to know it. It had a KING bell and was based on the Eb KING monster. I think Mike Lynch has it now.

[Norlan Bewley]

I wouldn't count Conn Selmer out of the tuba business just yet.

Just my impession.

Roger

Ditto!

Norlan

[JCalkin]

They are basically King 2341 BBbs with a Dillon-style chop job.

The original prototype done for Conn by Matt Walters at Dillon Music and what Conn pieced together out of their parts bins to save money by not spending any money on tooling were SIGNIFICANTLY different. Conn cheated the design left and right, up and down...

What Conn sold was a hatchet job...

I agree here. Conn took a lot of shortcuts on the production model. However, I had the 56J prototype that Matt made and it was EXCELLENT IN EVERY WAY. (Sound, intonation , etc..) I had the prototype for 2 weeks so I had time to really get to know it. It had a KING bell and was based on the Eb KING monster. I think Mike Lynch has it now.

Yep. I played the Walters prototype while visiting Mike Lynch in Idaho some years back. It is FAR superior to the production models IMO. Had Conn stuck with Matt's design (not sure why they changed it, both the proto and production horns were built from available Conn BBb parts, IIRC) they would have had a winner.

Not that the 5xJ was a bad line per se, but it wasn't for me.

[Bob Kolada]

How does a 2J compare to a 56J? I would assume they are quite different , but I've only seen and played the 56J. I like it alright, but to me it is a bit light. I prefer the 2341 over it.

[MikeMason]

They r both c tubas.that's about it...

[iiipopes]

How does a 2J compare to a 56J? I would assume they are quite different , but I've only seen and played the 56J. I like it alright, but to me it is a bit light. I prefer the 2341 over it.

Having played both, they play as any 3/4 version of a tuba to a similar 4/4 version of a tuba would play: the 2J has a "smaller" tone all the way around, although with similar intonation characteristics until you get to the really low register, which of course is more grainy, and a little more "riding throttle" with the 2J only having 4 valves.

[averagejoe]

I love my 56j! Intonation is very consistent throughout registers, and I love the tone quality. People often bemoan the 5th valves, but my horn doesn't seem to suffer at all from the fifth. On the other hand I had trouble getting a full resonance with the fourth valve when I first got my horn, but after buzzing and half valving exercises it seems to be fine now. I have no idea when my 56j was produced, as I bought it used. If anybody can date my horn, I would be very appreciative. the serial is 841252.