elbow flapping: tuba and horn players

[imperialbari]

Please, watch out!

This poll is an initial research for bloke’s idea about marketing an elbow steadying harness. He couldn’t sell it to string players.

[arpthark]

Regardless of whether the performer is playing well or not, I find any kind of extraneous movement while performing very distracting. I was guilty of this for a while until my private lesson teacher suggested that the energy I was using "trying to fly" could be used instead towards playing musically and taking full breaths.

[circusboy]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g59-13sbcgo

[jamsav]

the best players can flap both elbows...I ve given up trying this...it distracted from trying to tap both feet ....

[Dan Schultz]

I put this sort of theatrics in the same category as 'toe-tapping'.

[Kory101]

I'm guilty of it in this video....Back when I was in 2nd year

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W1K7dpjiZSU" target="_blank

[iiipopes]

Without resorting to stiffening up, I try to minimize extraneous movements as much as possible. It just doesn't help. On a technical passage, it can throw the player out of balance and actually hinder instead of help.

One of the greatest exponents of no extraneous movements is Maurice Andre. He's almost a statue, whether executing bravura technical passages or romantic lyrical passages.

When taking pipe organ lessons, which involve, of course, the entire body, one of the first lessons is to try to learn to keep the torso relaxed, but erect, the elbows and knees in, moving only as necessary to reach the extremes of the keyboard, and keeping the wrists relaxed and the tops of the hands parallel to the keyboard, again to minimize extraneous movements, keep focused but relaxed, and therefore in a position to execute whatever is required.

Now that said, music is personal, we all move somewhat. To overly limit or stifle some natural movement, such as the slight expansion of the torso when taking a proper deep breath, or some modicum of movement of the elbow to help the wrist and fingers through a technical passage, can be detrimental as well, preventing the forearm, wrist and fingers from executing properly.

This is another one of those issues that can be best identified by a player by practicing in front of a mirror or with a proper teacher.

[tubatom91]

I do the lean, it doesn't hinder my playing so I keep doing it, I like to get into my studies

[Rev Rob]

How about furiously flapping eyebrows?

[iiipopes]

2/ Good Lutherans should honor the Sabbath and stay off TubeNet.

Thank God I'm Episcopalian.

Ditto.

[Kory101]

Atheists can stay though, right?

[Z-Tuba Dude]

I'm not sure that there is necessarily a correlation, one way, or the other.

As an ensemble player, it can certainly distract, but I don't see any harm in moving a bit, when one is soloing (as long as it doesn't negatively effect the product).

After all, if we are too still, we might end up looking like (and maybe being replaced by) those Japanese music-playing robots!

[Tuba Steve]

I uses to elbow flap I did not see a direct difference in my playing when my professor made me stop.
I think its just a nervous habbit.

[Kory101]

In all seriousness, I do move when I play. I find it in now way has a negative effect on my playing. I had a lesson with an established soloist and they suggested I maybe try to stop moving. I tried to keep still when I played but it didn't feel right. I went back to doing what I was doing and haven't looked back.

[imperialbari]

At least tubists aren’t as bad as trombonists: less compulsive right arm jerking during fast scale work.

[Kory101]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omrNESc_9i8" target="_blank

Principal Trombone of the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra seems to be doing just fine....

[Rick Denney]

Movement is either a result of music flowing through the musician's body, or an affection designed to impress the audience. In the former case, it does not distract from the music, but it also doesn't make the music. In the latter case, it's a symptom of a disease that usually manifests a range of other non-musical symptoms.

If the music moves me, I move. If it doesn't, I don't. If I'm thinking about moving, I'm not thinking about music. If I'm thinking about music and some part of my body moves without my input, well, I just let it be. Thinking about not moving distracts from the music as much as thinking about moving.

Audiences can usually tell the difference. And if they can't, it doesn't matter.

Rick "who doesn't think the movement of the members of the Vienna Philharmonic detracts from their sonic product" Denney

[tubainty]

If anybody has ever seen mark hetzler (trombonist with empire brass) perform they know that he moves a whole lot . But it is in no way distracting from the music. This summer I saw him do a concert and on one piece all he had were up beats and he was moving all around. But he made that very simple line into music, something most people have trouble doing (I assume )... Any way he is a GREAT trombonist and his movement not only doesn't negatively affect his playing but I'd feel weird watching him play sitting still. Sometimes the music moves, don't fight it.

[J.c. Sherman]

Is it because of the player, the music, or the musician?

I move a bit... I admit it. Mostly, I try to use it for humorous or pantomime purpose. It can be a great way to communicate with an audience. It's acting, and it can enhance the performance, at least the non-musical components.

My eyebrows are physically attached to my embouchure... no one is going to disengage them without destroying me as a player

"Proud elbows" are either going to be an affectation, or something effected by the music. An audience will know INSTANTLY which is which. Other tubists will as well. If it's a part of the music making, it will be ignored. If it's part of the physical performance of the work, it's a crutch and that will be transparent.

A little movement, with the right cause, will be accepted by your audience (you know, the only ones who matter). A great deal of movement with the same control as most flautists' or singers' vibrato will be abhorred instantly.

We should all relax and let the product guide us... all else is secondary.

J.c.S.

[imperialbari]

As long as everybody have fastened their seat belts during take-off, they will be OK