Marching: Marching tuba versus sousaphone

[ralphbsz]

(Reminder: I'm not a tuba player, only the dad of a budding tuba player. I play the piano, so questions like moving with my instrument are very foreign to me)

My son is an 8th grader, and will soon be attending high school. In our area, if you want to do any music in high school, you will very likely be in the marching band, it's not optional. As a tuba player, that means you will be marching with a big instrument. Fortunately, he's a sturdy lad (rugby player, and one of the strongest and fastest students in his school), so I'm not worried about this being too hard.

He's been looking at the various high schools he could attend. One of them marches with "marching tubas", three-valve piston instruments held on the shoulder. The students refer to them as "contra bugle", although that's probably technically incorrect (as the real contra bugle would be in GG, these are in BBb). They have two kinds, older Yamaha convertibles (which are also used for beginners in the sit-down part of the band program), and newer larger Yamaha permanent instruments, probably the YBB-202. Another high school uses sousaphones, and just bought a set of new silver-colored Conn horns (don't know the model number). He has played both for about half hour, and he can handle either just fine (although both cause shoulder pain, and making good music while moving your feet and staying in formation is surprisingly hard).

So here is my question: From a musical (sound-production) and ergonomic (schlepping the blech): Would you prefer a shoulder-held marching tuba, or a sousaphone?

(*) Blech: Yiddish and German derogatory term for sheet metal. Today often used as a general insult for something that's badly made, or silly. For example, a particularly useless person might be referred to as a "Duennblechbohrer", or "person who drills thin sheet metal". Snotty classical musicians refer to saxophones as "Blechklarinette". In the case of a tuba, there happens to be a lot of blech, rather well made, so I mean the term as humor, not as an insult.

Oh, and please don't bother commenting on the general musical quality of school music programs, and the merits of marching while making music (or lack thereof). I know all that. He is going to go to high school, and the high school will have a music program, and being in the music program will require marching. So he will have to march, unless he wants to completely opt out of school music and do pottery and P.E. instead.

[TUBUD]

Gofor the sousaphone. The weight rests on your shoulder. The convertible tuba when not being played is held in front with both arms making it very front heavy and hard on the lower back.

[Uncle Buck]

Gofor the sousaphone. The weight rests on your shoulder. The convertible tuba when not being played is held in front with both arms making it very front heavy and hard on the lower back.

+1. A thirty minute test of a sousaphone gave him a pretty good idea of what it will feel like.

A thirty minute test of the on-the-shoulder Yamaha did not. After extended rehearsals, parades, etc., he will soon learn that the pain comes in the arm, particularly the arm that is supporting the instrument under the bell.

Plus, the Conn sousas really do sound better, lots better, than the Yamahas you described.

[sousaphone68]

I started marching with a BH imperial at age 13 and found the strap and the weight a killer on the lower back.
I have a sousaphone now and it is an easier carry on a long parade.

Transporting an upright or convertible tuba in its case is easier than transporting a sousa in its case
On the whole I prefer my sousa for marching and standing gigs.

[aqualung]

The 201s with the marching conversion were an ergonomic nightmare. But the new Yammies balance and handle better than anything else I've experienced.

[Michael Bush]

The contra is more satisfying for the player, in my experience. Maybe I should just say, "I found the contra more satisfying when I was marching." Good sousaphones played by good musicians sound better to the audience in an outdoor environment. That, and they look ridiculous (in my not necessarily humble opinion, and I can live through the flames).

On balance, I would go for the contras for the sheer fun for the player, and then make sure he has good audience-oriented music-making equipment to use in concert season.

You are going to get every imaginable opinion about this. So this is mine. It will not likely be the majority view.

[acjcf2]

Having marched with a Conn FG Sousphone and played a Conn 10J and 20J in concert band back in the day, I had have to lean towards the souzy. I tried marching with the 10J once during practice before a football game and that ended that experiment real quick. In fairness to the convertable I have no experience. Not sure marching tubas were in vouge back in the late 60's early 70's.

I got booted from band my junior year because I signed up for Drivers Ed and it interfeared with band. Director said "no march during the fall, no play period."
Oh well, the joke's on him.


Jim

[ken k]

i would choose the school based on which school has the better band and/or the better teacher. the horn is irrelevant. he will only be playing it for about 3 months. what kind of concert tubas do they have? that is what he will be playing for the other 9 months. what kind of concert band program do they have? what kind of repertoire do they usually play? Does the school have an orchestra he could also participate in?

Personally i prefer sousas. I have marched in drum corps and played contras back in the day and they were fine. i enjoyed them. And the new full-sized marching tubas are great players but are very heavy and difficult to lug around when you are not playing. the sousa? you stick it on your shoulder and forget about it. As for the 3/4 size convertible tubas, they are useless out side. I was just at a football game tonight and the visiting band had three of the little yamahas and i could not hear them. Our two sousa players were much more audible. I do not know how good the other players were, but I would assume they were decent players because the school has a good reputation for its music program. the marching tubas tend to have a more directional tone which could be the reason i had trouble hearing the other tubas since i was at the 35 yard line and not straight on at the 50.

Again, a good player can make either horn sound fine.

ps allow me to make one comment concerning the merits of marching band. More people will see the marching band at a football game, parade, or competition, than will see all the other performance groups in the school for the rest of the year, so its value as a public relations tool is huge. Like it or not MB pays the bills so to speak and makes it possible to have the other ensembles in the school. Granted that is not a musical justification for it, but rather more of a practical or realistic justification. Plus the kids generally have a lot of fun doing it believe it or not, once they give it a chance. the social aspect of it is hard to beat. friendships will be formed that will last a long time. OK that was more than one comment but i will get off my soap box now....

[opus37]

I agree with Ken's post. Marching band for me was with a plastic sousa. Not the greatest for sound, but the fun and excitement of being part of group made up for the lousy musicality. Like any team, it's the friends and experiences you can cherish for a lifetime that counts in HIgh School.

[GC]

Marching tubas (at least the bigger ones) may sound better than most modern Sousaphones (but not all), but they don't balance as well and cause more physical stress. The center of gravity of a Sousaphone is within the body, so it doesn't tend to mess up balance or take much more effort during quick moves. I didn't mind marching a Sousaphone or a bell-front tuba with a strap, but ten minutes with a shoulder-mounted tuba left me in considerable pain.

[ScottM]

The one point not mentioned is the shoulder style tuba will drain the contents from the lead pipe down the front of you on every turn if you have to lift the bell up to avoid hitting someone, or even just lift the bell to aim the sound into the stands. Sousaphones are hard on the shoulder but not as hard as a shoulder style tuba. Played both in college and much preferred the sousaphone.
Scott M

[euphomate]

[quote="talleyrand"] That, and they look ridiculous (in my not necessarily humble opinion, and I can live through the flames).

At last! Some honesty on sousaphones! Also a brave man, but you may need to don an asbestos suit my friend.

[bearphonium]

No experience with anything but a sousaphone...which I like a lot.

[ralphbsz]

Interesting. Thanks for all the information! If I had to summarize, the balance seems to lean towards sousaphones, but with some good arguments for dedicated marching tubas too.

And, as several people pointed out: It doesn't really matter what you guys (the tuba experts) or me (the dad) thinks about sousaphone versus marching tuba versus playing the viola: Which tuba various schools use for marching is a tiny part of the arguments that go into selecting the school. Much more important things are: academics, a friendly atmosphere that's conducive to learning, a good music program in general (2/3 of which is spent in a concert band or symphony orchestra), where his friends are going, good sports programs, commute, cost (for private schools), and so on. Once he's at the school of choice, he will very likely join the band. One of the main reasons for that is that band is a social experience (as Ken and others pointed out). I like the way one of the current band students put it: You join the band, because then you don't have to worry about where on campus to eat lunch, and whom to hang out with: you will eat lunch in front of the band room with your band mates. And once he's in the band, he'll play whatever instrument the band director hands him.