Microphones

[stephennutt2011]

So I'm looking around doing research on different microphones/setups.
My request for information comes in 2 parts;
1) What microphones/audio equipment will be good for recording brass instruments

2) What microphones/audio equipment will be good for doing live audio amplification of brass instruments, especially when combined with drum sets, piano, and saxophones.

I'm looking for something that is of high quality without spending thousands of dollars.
Looking around, I've seen word about Shure mics as well as the CAD GXL series mics. Thoughts on these?

To be noted: I have the Zoom H2 that I normally use for myself, but I'm looking for a setup for a small-medium sized brass band.

[tubajon]

I have a Sony ECM 957 stereo condenser mic. I've owned this for about 12 years but I've hardly used it. It comes with a small tripod stand, a cloth storage bag, and a cable with an 1/8th inch jack. $100 I think is a good price. I am the original owner and I believe I paid about $300 for it back in 2000.

[Udi]

I have very good experience with recording sousaphone, tuba and trombone with the Sennheiser 421, both solo and with other instruments around. It's also great for live shows, but most venues use less expensive microphones. After trying other microphones along the years, today it is my number one choice.

Common microphones that do a good work amplifying live shows with many kinds of instruments are the the Shure 57 and 58. I would ask a soundman about the difference between the two, but both are good basic microphones used often to amplify all brass instruments in bands I play with. They are also very durable, which is important for microphones that get used frequntly, and sometimes sadly get hit or dropped...

[swillafew]

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-audi ... 1000000000" target="_blank

I own two of these, they record very well in many applications. I don't know of a better deal for the money.

[Chadtuba]

Audio Technica 3035 has been my go to mic for many many years both live and studio use.

[rusty]

+1 on 421s for brass instruments. 3035s are decent but discontinued

[PaulTkachenko]

421 great for tuba in studio (and live). For a bit more money, RE20 also a great mike http://m.electrovoice.com/#family/31" target="_blank

For recording a brass band, the Sony above will work very well. I used to have one. Very good sound.

[Highpitch]

The classic RCA 77DX ribbon was always the ultimate brass mic.

Owning one today is a privilege, your best bet is to call studios in your area and see if they have one or two and set up a session.

The NADY RSM-2 is a close clone, and is around $200 street.

DDG

[Tom]

A Shure 57 would get the job done and they're only about $65-$75. They are typically the "go-to" instrumental mic for live shows, but can record well, too. The Shure 58 woud work, too, but is more of a vocal mic.

Generally speaking, if you can't take something like a Shure 57 and make is sound the way you want, you're not ready to drop hundreds or even thousands on anything more exotic.

However, if you really want to go nuts, look into into something like the high-end Shure ribbon and condenser mics. I've used a a KSM353 on trombone, but they're a bit much for casual user as they run about $700 or so. The 137 and 141 are worth a look also but are on the higher end of the price spectrum.

The mic does matter, but what matters more is placement and what the audio guy does with the input, ie "recording technique."

[Ricko]

+1 on the SM57

Keep in mind there are mics for recording and there are other mics for sound reinforcement and one that works well on one doesn't always work well on the other.

On the live sound end of things - the SM57 is a good mic that won't freak out in a loud environment - if you have a clone instrument - you can also find a good clone SM57 from these folks => http://www.speakerrepair.com/mm5/mercha ... icrophones" target="_blank

Other tasty live mics might be the Sennheiser E602II or the Audix I5

For the recording end of things - the AKG 451 is a great general purpose recording mic that isn't obscenely expensive.

the SM58 mic is really designed as a general purpose VOCAL mic - it's going to roll off well above the bottom end of the tuba range...

[greatk82]

the SM58 mic is really designed as a general purpose VOCAL mic - it's going to roll off well above the bottom end of the tuba range...

This is a true statement, but only a difference of 10 Hz. A 58 rolls off at 50 Hz and a 57 at 40 Hz. I don't think the difference of a third is going to matter much as long as you have a decent preamp and someone who knows how to EQ a tuba.

[Lingon]

+1 on 421s, especially the older gray ones. If you have a lot of money another classic the Neumann U82 is great.

Beware of the CAD GXL, at least here, as they are described: "This new set of Chinese-built mics offers good-quality vocal and instrument recording on a budget." Seriously though, they may not hold up to the high sound pressure from brass instruments. You should really test that before buying.

[ken k]

cant go wrong with an sm57 for sound reinforcement cheap and durable.

i use a AKG clip on similar to this on my helicon. mine is older and i am not sure if it is the same model but this works great so I can move around a little and dont have to worry about playing into a mic.

http://www.akg.com/site/products/powers ... ge,EN.html" target="_blank

cant comment on the recording end.
k

[Udi]

On live shows I tape a Shure 57 directly onto my sousaphone bell. I do the same with a Sennheiser 421 on studio recordings, or in great live venues that have one. As Ken K said, I like the freedom it gives me to move around - http://youtu.be/45RwyoM3scI?t=1m21s" target="_blank" target="_blank

When you put the microphone deeper you get a darker, round sound, a bit like a bass guitar, while as you tape it closer to the rim of the bell you get a more edgy, biting sound (so it sounds more like a sousaphone )

[ken k]

when i saw the dirty dozen brass band a few years back the sousa player simply dropped the mic down into the horn. dont know what mic he used. I did not care that much for the sound, like udi said it did not sound much like a tuba at all, more like a bass.
k

[stephennutt2011]

Wow! Thanks for all the replies everyone, your input is very helpful! If you have more advice, by all means keep it coming!

[stephennutt2011]

One more question:
For recording of a small instrumental group,would you want a microphone set on each individual instrument or would it be better to have a single mic to record the whole ensemble?

[rusty]

One more question:
For recording of a small instrumental group,would you want a microphone set on each individual instrument or would it be better to have a single mic to record the whole ensemble?

single mic (or 2) for entire ensemble. this could be a stereo condenser like the sony someone posted (or the built-in mic on your h2) or a pair of either condensers or ribbons.

the room will play an important factor in this scenario. is there a specific room that recording will be taking place in?

[joh_tuba]

I have a very nice hard drive based recording console and expensive cables but cheaped out on the mics due to budget constraints.

I use a pair of MXL V63Ms. http://www.musiciansfriend.com/pro-audi ... microphone

I know it's cheap but they do a genuinely great job of capturing a very flattering clear sonic image. For $10 more you can get them with a shock mount.

The reviews(my only frame of reference) suggest that you would need to spend a lot more to get a better result. My recordings have nearly zero background noise and edit nicely in cubase. I just found this recording example: http://youtu.be/y2f7unrxmD8 I generally just plop both mics about ten feet back and about 6 feet off the ground and point them in a direction that makes sense to me. My goal is to get a a recording that sounds like what the audience hears live.

I'm NOT a well educated audiophile but my understanding is that condenser mics capture a more even and realistic sonic image BUT are much more fragile. That has been my experience with this mic. About every two years one of them develops some static and needs replaced. I'm gentle with them but it doesn't seem to make a difference.

One of them just recently gave up the ghost and I'm really intrigued by the Sennheiser 421. I know dynamic mics are supposed to be a lot more robust and 'warm' but less sensitive and tend to not have a very flat response curve unless they are expensive.

What do those that have more of a clue then myself suggest?

[DPlander]

If your going to record a small ensemble and your willingto drop about 4-500 then I would recomend a Rhode NT4 Microphone. It is a single stereo microphone and you can attach to a single microphone stand and record stereo. I have used one a coupleoftimes andthey sound great.

I do have to give a +1 to the sm57, being a professional sound engineer I can agree with everything that has been said about them. They do sound great and will work in any situation.

Hope this helps.