History Thread: The evolution of the tuba in America

[Jess Haney]

I believe the idea of front piston tubas which is very much an American idea came from fitting sousaphone valve sets onto tubas. The idea of the 6/4 BAT also came from trying to make upright tubas sound like sousaphones.

I would be interested why the Eb tuba went out of fashion in US - it is surely a better size tuba to start kids on than a Bb?

That is an interesting thought. But I have been hearing that some middle school band directors are buying some of the older smaller Eb's in order to use them as beginner horns for the younger kids. With the bass clef Eb being in the same position as the C for trumpet some directors see it as an easy switch and they can be baught for little to nothing. The harder move is then from Eb to BBb later on in middle school or high school.

[Dan Schultz]

......I have been hearing that some middle school band directors are buying some of the older smaller Eb's in order to use them as beginner horns for the younger kids. With the bass clef Eb being in the same position as the C for trumpet some directors see it as an easy switch and they can be baught for little to nothing. The harder move is then from Eb to BBb later on in middle school or high school.

It was totally common in this area to have nothing but Eb tubas in grade school bands when I started playing in the 50's. I didn't play a BBb tuba until high school. I don't recall the transition from Eb to BBb being a problem. Kids are quick learners!

[opus37]

In regard to the demise of the Eb tuba in the US, I think you have to follow the money. Eb tubas were prevalent up until the 1950's because they were available and relatively inexpensive. In the 1960's the BBb showed up because the High Schools could afford one type of horn and everybody shared. The older ones were passed down to the middle schools. Long about that time the fiberglass horns started becoming available. Those were lighter, cheaper and more durable. They were also in BBb. Thus my theory that it is all about cost management.

[Uncle Buck]

I think the comments about whether starting kids on EEb first and then learning BBb later are slightly missing the point.

The fact that this pattern has fallen out of use in the United States probably has very little to do with what works best for the students. (As Tinker pointed out, kids are pretty adaptable.) It probably had a lot more to do with which alternative was less of a hassle for the band director.

And of course the cost thing - there are still schools that have nothing but a fiberglass sousaphone for all grades, marching and concert, etc.

[Z-Tuba Dude]

I just can't imagien why ANYONE would have thought it a good idea to have transposing instruments! It is a hard concept to grasp, but try explaining it to 7th graders!!! Explain to Sarah why is is that when she plays a C on her clarinet it doesn't match the C her mom plays on the piano OR the C that her brother played on his Alto Sax!

I think that originally, the idea was to keep the players from having to read too many ledger lines, keeping the "meat and potatoes" register in the staff, for most instruments (hard for US to imagine --- being the only contrabass instruments which read concert pitch!).

That certainly makes sense, given the way the Horn developed in history.

Transposing within families of instruments also facilitates switching back and forth between instruments, without having to switch fingerings (again, a concept lost on us!).

[Z-Tuba Dude]

I believe the idea of front piston tubas which is very much an American idea came from fitting sousaphone valve sets onto tubas.

I have also observed that the Civil War "over the shoulder" horns, by necessesity, had "front action" valves (mostly rotary, though).

[Rick Denney]

Just some tidbits:

The first tuba (Wieprecht's "Basstuba") was built in 1836 and was pitched in F. It used Berlinerpumpen, which were really the forerunner of the rotary valve, despite that they went up and down. Cerveny supposedly built the first rotary valve on a tuba and also built the first contrabass tuba pitched in C. That was, again supposedly, in the 1840's.

Sax built saxhorns in Eb and Bb, for reasons that Klaus already explained, and these were the basis for the first use of tubas in France and Britain. The U.S. borrowed heavily from Britain for its musical traditions until the later 19th century which saw a significant migration from Germany. So, you have over-the-shoulder saxhorns during the WNA (War of Northern Agression) and those used rotary valves, but had outer branches in the saxhorn tradition. And you have instruments such as those from Distin or Boston Manufactory that were upright Eb bass tubas with Perinet piston valves, very similar to the upright Eb saxhorn basse in the saxhorn series.

Sax and Wieprecht were competitors, each attempting to create whole systems of brass instruments to sell to the military bands that were being formed at that time, primarily in Europe. The notion of an insrument system was made possible by the invention of the valve, which made chromatic instruments in the bass clef possible. Prior to that, instruments had a slide (trombone) or were forced to use tone holes (ophicleide). The former did not allow the more pronounced conical taper that made the sounds that were popular, and the latter had trouble playing loudly enough for large ensembles (not to mention other issues). As might be expected, Wieprecht was successful in Prussia, where he was from, and his instruments outfitted the Prussian Guard bands, for example, and in other areas of German influence. And Sax, operating in France, was successful in France, and in Britain and Italy.

The generation that popularized C tubas for orchestral use in the U.S. were not Jacobs, Bell, and Phillips, but rather Helleberg, who I really believe was also the first prominent American tuba player to use a contrabass tuba. Prior to that, American tuba players used Eb tubas, based on old pictures of, say, the Boston Symphony Orchestra.

I'm not sure that the first side-action tubas were based on the sousaphone. The dates don't work--they predated the sousaphone. I really think that some folks preferred perinet valves, but like the layout of rotary tubas, when they started experimenting with contrabass instruments. Bevan includes a picture of a Cerveny Bb rotary tuba with four valves, dated to 1872, which was still in an era when most American orchestras used an ophicleide and most British orchestras used a euphonium. The big rotary contrabass was Germanic in inspiration, but fit it with perinet valves, and you have the classic American side-action piston tuba. It did allow the valve section to be shared with helicons. I suspect contrabass tubas did not become common in orchestras until Wagner's music started getting widely played, and American orchestras well enough funded that they could afford that specialty instrument Wagner called for ("Kontrabasstuba"). Again, the earliest pictures of American tuba players with C rotary tubas were of Helleburg, maybe as early as the turn of the last century.

Given the dominance of Germanic orchestral thinking in American in the first part of the 20th century, the rotary contrabass would have been a concept desired by conductors. Both Conn and H. N. White (King) made rotary contrabass tubas in C and Bb, and they also made instruments of similar taper design with piston valves.

I suspect the 6/4 tuba was usually pitched in Bb and used in bands until Stokowski requested that Donatelli acquire something large for the Philadelphia Orchestra. He special-ordered that York C tuba that he subsequently sold to Jacobs. And that's where Jacobs's influence did (eventually) change American practice to the use of grand orchestral instruments. But even back then, the Conn 36J (from the 1930's) was also known as the "Orchestra Grand Bass" and available in C ("Orchestra" was a broader term in those days, however). Tubas of that size were made well back into the 19th century, before the time when sousaphones were popular. I've seen pictures of Lyon & Healy tubas, and also Keefer tubas, from the 1890's that were big in that way, though they had top-action valves suggesting a band application.

As for transposition, I really think that was a British brass band practice from the start. In orchestral literature, bass-clef brass instruments are always written in concert pitch, because from the start they were fully chromatic and didn't need tuning crooks and other means of mechanical transposition as used with trumpets and horns prior to the invention of practical valves. But the idea behind transposing in a brass band is so that the musician only has to learn one set of fingerings to align with the dots on the page, and can play any instrument with the music intended for that instrument. Anys sytem can work if diligently taught, and that one is. Generally, though, I'd prefer if my brain put an aural image of a particular pitch in my mind, rather than a fingering, on seeing said black dot.

Rick "thinking Bevan does a lot of summarizing on the subject of 19th-century American practice" Denney

[ralphbsz]

I love it! Where can I find this as a poster or sticker?

[Uncle Markie]

School bands and their tubas are a fairly recent phenomenon historically. You have to go back to the "business bands" of Gilmore, Sousa, Pryor, Liberati, etc. which were entertainment attractions in their day. The cornet soloists were the rock stars of their day, etc. Then came the "mail order cornet bands" that popped up all over the country about the same time. I guess the equivalent would be garage bands today. There were fraternal bands, veterans bands, and even local "union bands" that played for all sorts of affairs.
Everybody wanted to play cornet - but not everybody could do that and have a balanced band. Hence the advent of "background instruments" in the key of e-flat - not just tubas, but mellophones or alto horns too. It was easy to move a cornetist to these instruments because of the ledger lines "cornet fingering" - it works pretty well to get started with an e-flat tuba in bass clef. The alto horn parts were transposed to begin with, and the old editions even published "Bb bass" parts - transposed Bb tubas parts. Why? Because these bands were staffed with amateurs who were cozy with one clef and one set of fingerings. Over the years many professionals got their start with these "town bands".
Then, along comes C.G.Conn and his salesmen - the "music men" and Eb tubas were cheap to make and easy to blow. The BBb sousaphone becomes popular not just because of Sousa, but also with the advent of the big midwest landgrant college bands that show up after WWI. Those schools had compulsory ROTC, and many young men could play band instruments - hence the 100 piece marching band. Playing in the football was fun, and it beat marching around with a rifle on your shoulder.
Recording bell instruments are developed for just that - and became popular because they looked "modern" and so you see them proliferate in the 1920s through the 1950s.
The CC tuba - as an orchestra tuba - becomes popular thanks to the Hellebergs, who convince William Bell that bands are "going out" and that the CC tuba is better suited to the work more likely to be available - symphony orchestras, so Bell gets one, and teaches legions of students to play CC. In fact Bell probably started on Eb in the "boys band" he began with back in Iowa - became an acomplished musician and could play any tuba in any key it was built in pretty early on. He played a BBb sousaphone with Sousa, and a BBb Martin recording bass with the Goldman Band during the summer - back when the NY Phil was a 32-week employment proposition. Arnold Jacobs did the same thing (and with a Martin) until the CSO became a 52-week job. Times changed.
Educators misused the Eb tuba for years - giving it to unpromising trumpet players willing to switch "down" to tuba. A lot of those instruments were probably junk to begin with - the "Kratt" Eb tubas in my school band were immediately nicknamed as something else!
Musically the section of two Eb tubas and two BBb tubas makes a lot of sense for a concert band - you get octaves with the players in comfortable ranges. Commercially, one BBb tuba became the norm for dance bands, dixieland bands and circus bands a long time ago - when used as a "bass" instrument. As a professional it's a rare treat to play in a section these days.
Orchestra work dictates different equipment - a lot of the time you're playing ophicleide parts - the F or Eb tuba replaces that obsolete instrument nicely.

Sorry for the lousy grammar here - but I think you get the point.

Mark Heter

[imperialbari]

The early Bb bass parts were not for BBb basses, but for instruments in the tenor-baritone range. Goes for the US as well as for the UK.

Klaus

[eupher61]

they are called "recording bell" or "recording bass" for more than their modern looks. Functionality.

[Art Hovey]

There were no small BBb tubas like the YBB-103 & 105 around when I was a kid.
My father started me and my generation off on Eb tubas, just as he and his generation had done.

But now small BBb tubas are pretty common, and they sound better in the cash register than those crappy Eefers ever did. (I'm not talking about the instruments that Sheridan and Baadsvik use!)

Kids find it very easy to switch from euphonium to a small BBb. My young students play better after that switch than I ever did just after starting on the big horn.