Odd question for a tuba forum ....

[oldbandnerd]

but I know someone knows this. I'm trying to sell a King 3B with F trigger for a friend and someone called me about about it and asked me 2 questions I couldn't answer. Someone ( bloke,tubatinker ...et al )here does.
The potential buyer is replaceing a Conn 88Hlost in a house fire that belonged to his son. He wanted to know :
1.) Is this King a large bore trombone ? I'm not sure but it does take a small shank mouthpiece. This leads me to believe it is at best a medium bore horn.
2.) How does it compare to the Conn ?

Any help ... anyone ...?

[imperialbari]

The King 3B is very much smaller than a Conn 88H.

The King equivalent of an 88H would be the 4B.

Klaus

[tubarepair]

I believe the 3B has a .508" bore and takes a small-shank mouthpiece, while the 88H has a .547" bore and uses a large-shank mouthpiece.

[gregsundt]

As I recall, the 3B is a medium bore (.525), as compared with the large symphonic bore (.547) of the 4B, 88H, 42B, etc. Depending on how his son uses it, the King could be a step in the right direction, or a disappointment.

I don't think you will ever see a 3B in a semi-pro or higher orchestra. It is most commonly used in band work, jazz section playing, and occasionally for quintet, solo, and jazz/combo stuff. The 88H, while primarily a symphonic trombone, is remarkably versatile. If the player is strong, fairly accomplished, and really likes his Conn, I think the King would be a poor substitute.

Hope this helps.

[imperialbari]

The best known trombone with the 0.525" bore is the Bach 36. It has no King equivalent.

The King 3B has the 0.508" bore:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_3B

[oldbandnerd]

The potential user of this horn is a second year band student. I suppose that would be 7th or 8th grade. He might appreciate a smaller bore horn to play on right now.
The guy I am selling this for auditioned for and got into the Virginia Commonwealth Uni. jazz band as a freshman in 1983. It must be a good horn.

[pgym]

Hickeys and Wikipedia list the bore of the King 3B as .508/12.9 mm. Horn Guys and WWBW list a 3B Plus, which is .525/13.4 mm. Both would be considered medium bore.

[imperialbari]

My King tenor is the 2B+, which only comes straight, with a 0.500" bore and a 7-5/8" bell. I bought this specific sample because it was extremely responsive. I have bought 3B’s for student, and would have one myself, if it wasn’t for the 2B+.

If for a younger teenager student, I would consider the 3B more adequate than the Conn 88H.

Klaus

[imperialbari]

I never saw a 3B+, but then I have a 2B+ from 1983.

Klaus

[gregsundt]

The guy I am selling this for auditioned for and got into the Virginia Commonwealth Uni. jazz band as a freshman in 1983. It must be a good horn.

It is a good horn, for its intended use. I have played, sold, and liked the 3B for years. For the record:

• It is a .508 bore, not .525 as I posted earlier.
  It is a pro-quality horn, as is the Conn 88H et al. It should be a terrific horn for a second-year player.

[iiipopes]

I used to have a straight King 3B. It is the .508 bore as set forth above.

The straight King 3B for decades was considered one of the jazz and concert band lead trombones. The F-attachment version is for midsection work where there is an occasional need to trigger for technical passages. It's not a large enough bore to be a true bass bone, or even 4th stand jazz/swing band, and unlike the straight version, can get grainy or stuffy.

The "Dorsey" or "2B" or "Liberty" model bone was smaller bore, originally .481, later .491 after assimilation by the cyborg, but was never dual bore in the pre-cyborg era:

http://www.hnwhite.com/King/Trombone%20 ... 0Large.jpg" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank" target="_blank

[ken k]

Personally I think the 3B is the perfect concert band trombone, and great horn for general all around playing. Its tone is clear and direct and yet can be warm. it also will have a different tone from the euphonium as it should. Also for a second year student it has a very appropriate bore size. i have heard way too many students over the years trying to play .547 horns who can not support the larger bore and then their sound is unfocused and woofy.
ken "played trombone in a previous life..." k

[Donn]

2.) How does it compare to the Conn ?

Not like it at all, as you now know. The rest be a lot of second-guessing.

[Chadtuba]

I had a King 3B Silversonic with the F trigger for a few years (late 60's vintage) and absolutely loved that horn. I ended up selling it to a buddy for use in the 3rd chair of the local semi-pro jazz band I used to play in. Six years later, he's still playing it and loving it. If I played more tenor trombone I'd definitely look for another one of those, but as stated by others, this is a jazz and concert band horn and that's all I do so the right shoe for the right foot

[oldbandnerd]

I sold the trombone today. The young student seemd real pleased with it even though it's smaller than the Conn. He recognized the difference right away but wasn't put off by it.
Keep the info coming anway. It's interesting to know .

[Bob Kolada]

"I wish more trombonists in brass quintets, and more ofteen, used the size that is BETWEEN the size of a 3B and the size of a 4B."

Back when I was a music student I played in the "older students" brass quintet. I didn't own my own horn at the beginning of the semester and was using a beater 185 for concert band. I didn't trust me on that horn for quintet so I used my bass trombone for a few weeks in the quintet.

The quintet ended up being two trumpets, a horn (ewww), a EUPHONIUM, and me on bass trombone with a "jazzy" mouthpiece. I finally got my small King Eb and used that. The tuba instructor then made a smart-*** comment about two euphoniums after the brass studio recital.

[Lee Stofer]

The student will probably also appreciate the King handslide, which is generally superior to a Conn slide - just my observation, having worked on and played 'em. A Conn trombone can be a joy to play, but almost never has the slide action of a King.