Big vs Loud?

[Tuboss2]

Alright guys, I feel like there hasn't been a topic solely about this. Lots of people recently have been asking or trying to figure out the difference between the two. So I think it's time for a topic on this subject.

What's the differences between sounding big and being loud. Both have there place. Some prefer one or the other. It's honestly a matter or what you think works for you in my opinion. For example, lemme me use some of my experiences.

I'm a really loud tuba player. But I struggle with playing big and think playin is just playing loud. But it isn't. I sometime think it's just playing loud with no edge. But for some reason that can't be it.

So the main questions: 1: what does it mean when someone tells you: sound big? 2: if your outside with a sousaphone on for marching band, a parade, in the stands, etc, what would be better?

[Tubadork]

Loud is like a volume knob.
Big is the size of the radio.

I wanna be surround sound all the time regardless of the volume.


Bill

[Tuboss2]

Comparing this to radios...never heard of that. So, sounding big could be like sounding like a surround sound system they have in movie theaters?

[THE TUBA]

Big is more about presence, resonance, and tone. Loud is purely in terms of volume.

[dmeacham5]

To me sounding big has nothing to do with volume, it has to d with filling the room up, you can play quite as can be but still fill the room up. I am still working on it but when I do it I feel great about my playing. Playing loud is just with volume you can play extremely loud but sound "hollow" as I've heard some say. I just need some advice on how to play "big" easily.

[Tuboss2]

Dmeacham5, that's the same problem I have. I'd like some tips on that. I can already play loud, and have no problem filling the room up, I mean, if you can hear stuff ringing/vibrating around the room, you must be doing something right haha. I'd like to do the same thing, while playing big.

And how do you sound hollow while playing loud? Like you mean the sound is thin? I've never heard of that before.

[2GBTG]

Ms. Dimple says people like it both Big and Loud...just saying.
http://youtu.be/vBWon-JabwQ



Kitch

[Tuboss2]

How would one sound big as opposed to loud...because I can already do that. Just open your teeth and push abunch of air through the instrument.

[UDELBR]

Think wattage vs. enveloping presence. Different.

[Tuboss2]

Fire up an expensive stereo in a car. A really nice one.

Set the EQ with the bass all level at 0 (the midline, not negative) and leave the mids and treble alone. Listen to it both loudly and softly play stuff with a strong bass part.

Repeat the same excerpt of music, this time with the treble cut to 0 (again, the midline on the board, not the negative range) while leaving the mids alone and bumping up the bass a good bit. Listen to this both loudly and softly.

There is no comparison in the sound quality of the bass in the music when cut to the midline (zero) versus when it is up in the normal range.

Quality in this sense is completely subjective. But there is - again - no comparison. This should tell you how to discern between loud and big. Big is fat, thick, rich sound. Thin is edgy and crass. Loud is simply decibels.

You can be big and loud. Crass is another topic that we have discussed ad nauseam...

You claim to be "working" on edgy playing. Playing with the typical HBCU sound is looked down upon by so many because it is a cop out. It is the EASIEST way to get volume. It takes no work at all to sound like that. None. I could do that my first week on a sousaphone and my director nearly beheaded me with the bell trying to keep my jaw and throat open. The only "work" in getting that sound is to get *more* of that sound. The sound itself is attained by doing just about everything incorrectly in a physical sense.

Good luck.

Hm. I know it is look down upon many. But I wouldn't say it's easy. It does take some chops to play like that.

You do pose an interesting point. You're basically saying that the way a tuba/sousaphone playing loud correctly shouldn't sound like it does in HBCU, since there basically just playing with lots of edge and sound really crass.(which I can do but I don't want it to be the only thing I can do when it comes to playing loud).

I'll try different types of loud while practicing tomorrow keeping in mind what you said. Focus on sounding big will be important.

[Tuboss2]

You honestly got me man. I've sent a pm to you.

[royjohn]

I thought that was a great post by the elephant.

Another way to look at tone is that it can be too edgey, in which case there are too many upper partials (too much treble) for the amount of bass. Or it can be hollow, which is basically the opposite, or too much bass without enough treble. A balanced tone, which sounds big, will have a mixture of both. It will have carrying power due to the high frequencies, and will envelope you with the low frequencies.

I agree that if one overblows enough, one will get that edgey, blatty tone. It takes some strength, but not much else, as the elephant said. If one gets a big enough tuba and a real big mouthpiece, one can get a rather hollow tone, too. It's getting a balanced tone that is more difficult. Keeping this tone down into the ppp range is hard and keeping it into the fff range is also difficult. The best players can do that and also keep that balance anywhere in between dynamically, in both high and low registers.

It's something to work on.

[Tuboss2]

It is something to work on. Besides, what's he highest dynamic in music, isn't it FFFF?

[The Big Ben]

Game, set and match- Elephant.

[Untersatz]

OMG..........Please tell me this isn't "Edgy (Marching Band) Sousaphone Sound"............Part II

[bigbob]

OMG..........Please tell me this isn't "Edgy (Marching Band) Sousaphone Sound"............Part II

Same teenybopper almost the same title except replace edgey with loud....go practice Kid.....BB

[Tuboss2]

No no it won't be a repeat of that Guys. We've already been through that.

And one thing, I have some questions I'd like to ask then I guess we could call this thread a wrap...

Lets say I'm outside, we're playing a stand tune, and I'm playing with edgy/raunchy loud sound, what will it sound like on the other side of the field?

iPhone recorders don't really get all the of tuba sound do they?

And when y'all say strength, are you talking about strength of the chops?

Also, it seems that when I open up a lot and aim my air stream downwards, my notes become really thick and are being brought out to the forefront. Just an observation I got from my practice session. So would direction of air stream matter when playing big/loud.
Thanks.

[Untersatz]

Lets say I'm outside, we're playing a stand tune, and I'm playing with edgy/raunchy loud sound, what will it sound like on the other side of the field?

Did you not listen to a single thing people were telling you in your last thread?
It will sound like a BIG annoying sounding kazoo..........just like all of the videos that
you posted in your last thread

[Jay Bertolet]

'Nuff said.

[royjohn]

Must...not...hit...send...let...thread...die...auuurggghhhhh!!!