Face Pain While Playing Tuba

[HallTuba]

Hello everybody. I am Chris Hall and I play tuba. I am a student in high school; I'm not in college or pro at the moment.
Anyway, I have a physical problem. Whenever I play, my embouchure and top front teeth hurt. The mouthpiece I use currently is the PT-88 if it has anything to do with that. What could possibly be going wrong? I try separating the mouthpiece from my lips a little, but that doesn't help. Some helpful insight would be wonderful.

Thanks,
Chris Hall

[chronolith]

Hi Chris,

(I imagine I am not the only one who had the Chris Hall double-take...)

If you are in pain you need to get with a teacher right away. Bad habits are one thing, but doing damage is another thing altogether. Would you describe this pain as sharp focused pain in particular spot especially or maybe a pain that is a generalized strain?

Part of playing tuba well means relaxing and moving air naturally (not unlike you do when you sleep). The pain you describe sounds like an angle problem, being too forceful, or just unnatural strain. I suggest you find an expert and have them observe you so you do not do any lasting damage.

[HallTuba]

Thanks for your advice, it is greatly appreciated! I almost said that I wasn't of the Met Opera orchestra.

I will do so. I have also tried relaxing, but thus far no result has been noted. I will continue to try and identify this problem as it is agitating. When I play for long periods of times I develop red bumps which would possibly mean I'm allergic to the silver plating; in turn I will look into that as well.

[swillafew]

If you are in pain you need to get with a teacher right away.

That's the word. Pressure on the face from the mouthpiece might be the cause, but only a person watching you will know what's going on. Best of luck with it.

If you are 'trying too hard', take it easy and play something easy for you and see if the pain goes away. It will give you something to do while you wait for that lesson.

[ghmerrill]

I don't know anything about your size or experience, but from my experience that's a HUGE mouthpiece for an early student to be using. It's certainly larger than I was ever willing to go with.

And I once heard Oystein Baadsvik admonish a senior college tuba major in a master class for using exactly that mouthpiece as just too big for him. Get to an instructor (a TUBA instructor) and see about it. Or in the interim, try a smaller mouthpiece and see if it changes things for you.

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

Do you experience pain while playing the mouthpiece outside of the instrument?

[HallTuba]

I don't do too much playing on the mouthpiece, and when I do it's not much more than ten minutes a day. So no I do not experience pain while playing on only the mouthpiece, and the pain with instrument starts a while after I start playing.

[PaulMaybery]

It's always hard to know what someone else is experiencing, especially when we can not really see things.
Some issues like that may be 'perio' related. I had some gum issues a while back (with sensitivity in the lower front teeth) and realized like many people of a certain age, gum disease (uggh) was the problem. After I had some nasty oral surgery, things cleared up. Most of us simply do not know what is happening beneath the gum line and it is nothing to be ashamed of. Mine was with the lower teeth and the jaw bone was actually beginning to deteriorate. The area beneath the gum line was chronically inflamed and irritated, but I had no idea until my dentist took a good look and Xrays showed the problem. We never like to learn those things, but they are a reality. But, I really hope that there might be a simpler issue. The PT88 is a 'bucket' - I have one - great design - but for me it is only for times when I want an enormous low register. I never felt it to be a good "all purpose" mp unless you are a giant. When we play on the tuba we tend to anchor the mp rim firmly (but not too hard) and it will put a small amount of pressure on the teeth/jaw beneath. I tend to doubt that a slightly smaller mp would make much difference in that regard, but would rather just minimize some fatigue from having such a wide embouchure. The next time you have a dental exam, bring up that issue. Another thought is that you may be playing high up on the upper chops and the MP is resting above the teeth and on the jaw bone and it is becoming irritated. I'm not a dentist, but recent experiences have led me to think outside the box on these types of things.
Best wishes.

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

I don't do too much playing on the mouthpiece, and when I do it's not much more than ten minutes a day. So no I do not experience pain while playing on only the mouthpiece, and the pain with instrument starts a while after I start playing.

If this is severe pain, I would get it checked out by a doctor. If the doctor says everything is okay, why worry? The audience doesn't care how your mouth feels. They care how you sound.

[The Big Ben]

I don't do too much playing on the mouthpiece, and when I do it's not much more than ten minutes a day. So no I do not experience pain while playing on only the mouthpiece, and the pain with instrument starts a while after I start playing.

If this is severe pain, I would get it checked out by a doctor. If the doctor says everything is okay, why worry? The audience doesn't care how your mouth feels. They care how you sound.

Have a little bit of sense, old chum...

See a dentist and have your embouchure checked by a tuba teacher. Severe pain is always an indication that something is not right. Infection? Wrong mouthpiece? Incorrect embouchure? Could be any, all or a combination of those things.

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

After Bud Herseth smashed his face in a car crash, he reported extreme pain while he played for the next few months. He still played with the CSO in Orchestra Hall during that time. Just saying.

[PMeuph]

I'm no expert on this, but I think it would be worth spending some money and getting a lesson from somebody like Doug Elliot...

Why?

I assume that something is probably out of sync with your embouchure. Maybe you're putting too much pressure on your top lip/and teeth and not using an embouchure that's suited for your facial structure....


____
Not entirely relevant, but very interesting nonetheless:

I recently re-read Herbert L Clarke autobiography. Even he had problems adjusting the correct pressure of the mouthpiece and had to work at it...

http://abel.hive.no/trompet/clarke/bio/html_all/" target="_blank

[The Big Ben]

After Bud Herseth smashed his face in a car crash, he reported extreme pain while he played for the next few months. He still played with the CSO in Orchestra Hall during that time. Just saying.

He knew why his face hurt. This kid doesn't.

[Doug Elliott]

I'm no expert on this, but I think it would be worth spending some money and getting a lesson from somebody like Doug Elliot...

Why?

I assume that something is probably out of sync with your embouchure. Maybe you're putting too much pressure on your top lip/and teeth and not using an embouchure that's suited for your facial structure....

He's close to me and we have been in contact but no lesson yet. If there's anything to say I'll post it here.

[Zaphod Beeblebrox]

My last word is this: if it is not a medical problem, pain should not concern you. Think about how you sound.
EDIT: Accidental misquotation. Sorry, Big Ben.

[HallTuba]

I've been experimenting and I have a guess. My guess is that the angle I had the mouthpiece at was damaging, and that the mouthpiece doesn't fit the way my mouth is shaped. I also think I may be allergic to the silver plating on the mouthpiece as I tried a plastic one and no ring existed, and I remember a few instances where I played for an extended period of time and I got a rash and red bumps along the rim of the mouthpiece. This is just my best guess so I'm still going to go around and see some people such as Mr. Elliot in person.