3+1 EEb in Orchestra?

[tclements]

YIKES! No disrespect was intended. sorry ....

[imperialbari]

I have a right facing euphonium and a left facing euphonium, both compensating. But in general no conductor should complain right facing euphoniums. After all they are pretty much the standard configuration.

Klaus

[toobagrowl]

The Brits seem to use those 3+1 Eb tubas for everything, including orchestra. I don't particularly like the look or sound of those instruments for orchestra, but I think they sound quite good for brass band and the like (which they were obviously designed for). Top valve tubas are not very ergonomic for me; they become uncomfortable after a while. Much prefer front valve tubas.

[barry grrr-ero]

I also heard the RPO play Mahler 5 in Davies Hall (S.F.). While the tuba player was obviously a very good player, I thought the Besson Eb was the wrong instrument for that piece. Just one person's opinion. I think M5 sounds best on a 5/4 or 6/4 CC, or even a good BBb.

I've had a lot of non-professional and semi-professional (paid) experience playing orchestral music on a Besson Eb. It's fine in Berlioz and Mendelssohn. It's even OK for the earlier Bruckner symphonies. I liked using it on the Bruckner 9th. It's just right for Bartok's "Miraculous Mandarin" but less so for the Concerto for Orchestra. I wouldn't want to do Prokofiev 5 or "Romeo & Juliet" on one of those. For the Mahler symphonies, M1 is fine on an eefer. But for symphonies 2 - 9, I played them all on a prototype Miraphone 188, and even that felt rather small at times. In Mahler, the tuba is a 'super bass' to the entire orchestra. My two cents, anyway.

[Ian1]

Pop some headphones in and spend 10mins listening to this.

http://youtu.be/wXh5JprKqiU

Enjoy!

[Ian1]

Mahler 5
Listen to Owen Slade at 8:00.... Best ever.

http://youtu.be/H57VKzHVQpI" target="_blank

[barry grrr-ero]

Yes, that part sounds plenty loud enough, but there's TONS of low register stuff in Mahler 5 other than that. I'm not taking ANYTHING away from Mr. Slade. But I wouldn't want to play all those fast, low register runs in the scherzo on a 3 + 1 effer. Not because it can't be done, but because I don't feel that it puts enough weight and amplitude in the low end of the orchestra. Remember, without some restraints put on by the conductor, our trumpets and trombones tend to be pretty darn powerful (i.e. too loud).

[b.williams]

Pop some headphones in and spend 10mins listening to this.

http://youtu.be/wXh5JprKqiU

Enjoy!

Didn't like seeing the conductor's face 98% of the time. What a shame!

[kathott]

Yes, that is a superb (LPO) Mahler V. I had forgotten about that series of recordings.

[imperialbari]

Leslie?

[imperialbari]

Wind vibraphone.

The Leslie comment was about the rotating recording bell.

[imperialbari]

Eb?

[kathott]

Mahler 5
Listen to Owen Slade at 8:00.... Best ever.

http://youtu.be/H57VKzHVQpI" target="_blank" target="_blank

Yes, Owen Slade sounds fantastic. Britain has a national sound, something which is worth preserving.

[elihellsten]

I'm a regular E flat-player but I don't like bringing my Besson to orchestral gigs. I use it all the time for brass band work but I simply don't like the way it sounds in a full size orchestra. I prefer to bring a bigger horn or even my Miraphone Eb (front action). It's something about the way it blends (or in my experience, won't blend!) with the trombone section. This makes me experience all sorts of trouble, mostly intonation wise. I find it hard to "lock it in" with the rest of brass section, probably because of the naturally rounder and fluffier sound I make on the 3+1 tuba.

Just my two cents. I have never had any problems with conductors complaining.

[Wyvern]

but probably it's best place isn't "playing Tchaik 4".

I rather think a number of British players would disagree

Jonathan "who played Tchaik 6 on Wessex EEb only last week"

[finnbogi]

the round/fluffy/(lovely) comp-Eb certainly has it's place...but probably it's best place isn't "playing Tchaik 4".

I actually find my compensating E flat perfect for Tchaikovsky, whether it is the symphonies, ballets, overtures or operas...

[Untersatz]

but probably it's best place isn't "playing Tchaik 4".

Jonathan "who played Tchaik 6 on Wessex EEb only last week"

Comparing Tchaikovsky 6 to Tchaikovsky 4 in this context would be like comparing apples to oranges

[Antontuba]

Played Tchaik 1 on my Besson 981, DW 5L this afternoon, many compliments.

[barry grrr-ero]

Let's just clear one thing up. Whether you agree with him or not, 'Fletch' did not believe in using a 3+1 eefer on everything. He felt that doing so was, quote, "bone idleness", unquote (his words, not mine). He did not share some of cohorts belief that you could simply show up to any and all gigs with a 3+1 eefer. In fact, all efforts to enlarge the B&H Eb tuba were directly due to John Fletcher. As many of you will know, he quite often used a Holton 345 CC in the LSO that Arnold Jacobs had found for him. He expressed to me his concern that the Holton might, in fact, sound too big for the LSO and RFH. But at that time, there wasn't the abundance of good 5/4 CC tubas that you have now. Regardless, he sounded great no matter what tuba was in his lap.

At the time I was over there (early '80s), the guy in the LPO was using a B&H 3+1 compensating CC tuba. My understanding is that it's almost impossible to find one of those that will play even reasonably well in tune. I tried one and it was awful - I sent it back. FYI.

Barry 'make me a really good 3+1 CC tuba and I'll buy it' Guerrero

[cjk]

If I had an Eb and a BBb that I felt I could part out, I'd like to mix and match those parts into a CC. Maybe even build a bell front/bell up set up like the bloke Eb.

ahh yes...the "orchestral model".

The bows on the BBb are so long and so gently tapered, I suspect (??) that is all the parts that might be needed.

lol. the valves are 6 inches higher than the receiver. how could that be remotely comfortable??