Being the only tuba...

[bigboom]

When I have played parts with splits we usually put the first player on the upper split because he usually has the biggest sound and such and we put the other 3 on the lower part because the lower chairs usually don't put out nearly as much sound. If it is in something other than octaves than we usually split it even, Tuba 1 and 4 on the upper with 2 and 3 on the lower or the other way around. I'm not sure if this is the right way to do it but it has worked well for me.

I know in the comunity band I play in there is an extra bass bone player that will usually play the split tuba parts and when there is only one he will play them when he isn't playing another part.

Ben Dennis

[Mark]

Technically speaking, the bass part is written up an octave from what they are really playing, so they are really playing our octave.

Correct, the string bass sounds an octave lower than the written note (most of the time).

The tuba can only go a few notes lower than the bass and actually sound somewhat decent ...

Uh, if the bass has the standard E string, then a tuba should be able to play several notes, maybe an octave, lower than the bass ans still sound good. If the bass has the extension to play down to C, then a few notes.

(they're all pedal tones that go lower than the bass, and everyone would agree that they are pedal tones b/c they're that low)...

I wish the term pedal tones would just go away. (The tuba is not an organ, but the tuba is an organ stop isn't it?) If you are talking about a BBb or CC tuba, the Eb below the lowest E on the string bass is not a pedal tone.

[adam0408]

I was going to resist saying anything but I will because this has not yet been said:

I was recently playing a sousa march (Black Horse Troop), edited by Fredrick Fennel (I believe) and there was a note at the bottom that said "in sousa marches, the bottom octave is always preferred" So if you play a sousa march, play the bottom. ALWAYS. I trust Fredrick Fennel. He knew more than I do, thats for sure.

[Chuck(G)]

I was going to resist saying anything but I will because this has not yet been said:

I was recently playing a sousa march (Black Horse Troop), edited by Fredrick Fennel (I believe) and there was a note at the bottom that said "in sousa marches, the bottom octave is always preferred" So if you play a sousa march, play the bottom. ALWAYS. I trust Fredrick Fennel. He knew more than I do, thats for sure.

I've seen the notation too--and I think you're reading a different meaning into it than was intended. "Preferred" to me simply says that if you're able to put more instruments on the lower part than the upper part, you do it. The good Doctor did not say "play only the lower octave whenever possible".

If what was meant was "ignore the upper part", then why bother to include it? What end would be served by writing it out?

Have a look at:



Which is Sousa's own 1885 version of "Sound Off" from the Library of Congress. Note that the divisi sections have not been sprinkled in haphazardly. In fact, all notes in this part can be played on a 3-valve Eb tuba.

Now, if I had 4 tubas in the back row, would I put them all on the lower part? No--and I don't think that Dr. Fennell would have either. But you might put 3 on the lower part and 1 (strong player) on the upper. That's pretty much "preferring" the lower notes, isn't it?

[Anterux]

Chuck, I'm looking at that score from Sousa and in my opinion,
I think that if we have more than one tuba we should not consider the octaves as Ossia in the 2nd section. Both octaves should allways be played in that context.

The octaves in the TRIO section are different in my point of view. those octaves could, in my point of view, be considered Ossia.

Back to the topic, for exemple, in the case of that march, I would play all the lower part if I was the only tuba.

Just my point of view.

[TexTuba]

It's probably already been said but it depends. If there just octaves, I like to take the lower ones. If they're actual split notes, then ask the conductor.







Ralph

[Tabor]

Having been the "only tuba" for 17+ years, I feel more than qualified to help you in your decision. Forget what everyone else is saying. Play what you feel most comfortable with. If you feel the uppers are better for certain songs and the lowers are better for others, go for it and don't look back. After all, what's the worst that will happen? Will they fire you?

I agree. I was going to post almost the exact same thing.

-Tabor

[Tom Mason]

Not that I have been published very much,



If the split is octaves, and you are the only one, then usually the lower octave. There are usually bass clarinet, bass/third trombone, sometimes barifoneum parts that will double the upper octave.

The normal other split is perfect fifths. If this is the case, then the lower note is preferred as it is usually the root of the chord.

Of course, with the barifoneum parts, there are times when they are off playing nice countermelodies, melodies, or just trying to read treble clef when they are bass clef players.

Tom Mason

[Anterux]

...
Of course, with the barifoneum parts, there are times when they are off playing nice countermelodies, melodies, or just trying to read treble clef when they are bass clef players.

Tom Mason

Barifoneum!

Extraordinary name!!!

[Anterux]

Yes. I know. I just think it's a beautiful name.

Never heard it before. wonderful name indeed.

Barifoneum. Bariphonium.

Wonderful

[Chuck(G)]

I think that if we have more than one tuba we should not consider the octaves as Ossia in the 2nd section. Both octaves should allways be played in that context.

The octaves in the TRIO section are different in my point of view. those octaves could, in my point of view, be considered Ossia.

Back to the topic, for exemple, in the case of that march, I would play all the lower part if I was the only tuba..

Pretyy much right on the money, Antero. Looking at the bass line, it's obvious that Sousa's using divisi to punctuate important phrases and they should be retained if possible.

This isn't the first time that I've had the Fennell quote thrown at me as a reason to disregard the upper divisi parts--and how players and directors misunderstand it. It's obvious from listening that Fennell doesn't throw away upper divisi in his recordings; why do folks think it's okay when they perform? Would they throw away the second clarinet parts?

Thanks for giving me the opportunity to vent a pet peeve!

[Dean E]

Having been the "only tuba" for 17+ years, I feel more than qualified to help you in your decision. Forget what everyone else is saying. Play what you feel most comfortable with. If you feel the uppers are better for certain songs and the lowers are better for others, go for it and don't look back. After all, what's the worst that will happen? Will they fire you?

I agree. I was going to post almost the exact same thing. -Tabor

I play in community bands. I like to practice playing my 3-valve Eb horns in the staff, especially in lyrical and jazzy pieces, even if the parts are written lower. It's good practice for my upper register. Also, by experimenting, I gain experience about when the upper notes will not sound as well as the lower notes. In symphonic pieces, when the only tuba, I make sure to take one of my big horns and to play the lower notes, which as others indicate, are the chord roots.

When other tubas show up, they are either a 4-valve Eb or CC, or BBb, so it is natural for them to take the lower notes, and even improvise down an octave for the fun of it.

[sinfonian]

In our band we usually have 3 or more tubas and we put 1 on top and the rest on the bottom part.

Another twist is when to play the part down an octive lower then written. Last year we had a piece that had a nice descending bass line until it got to the Ab below the staff when it jumped up a 7th to the G on the bottom of the staff and continued to descend from their to Eb or D. A couple of us interperted that to mean that the arranger didn't think the tuba could keep going down to the Eb or D an octive below the staff. We took it on ourselves to continue the descent without jumping back up to the G.

Othertimes at the end of a section or piece our strongest player will drop the final note down an octive (with the director's blessing) to give more depth to the bass.

My 2¢.

[Dan Schultz]

Othertimes at the end of a section or piece our strongest player will drop the final note down an octive

My opinion on this is that it is just as annoying as the trumpets taking things up an octave You guys do what you wish but for my money, I'm going to play what's written.

As far as split parts are concerned... be honest guys... you KNOW what your capabilities are and there's no need to push your limits... especially in a performance. Do what sounds best.

[Chuck(G)]

There are also some works (a few Grainger pieces come to mind) that take the tuba down to a low D or lower. If I were the only tuba in a good-sized band and the passage was marked ff, I'd take the part up an octave just to be heard.

[Rick Denney]

What gives? Is it the custom in US concert band playing that divisi are really ossia?

My rule of thumb has been "if it's written in the part, then someone had better be playing it. You certainly couldn't get away with "pick and choose" playing in a brass band.

I see the divisi octaves mostly in older arrangements, from back in the day when bands usually had both Eb and Bb tubas. I've always thought most of the upper octaves were written for the benefit of Eb bass players who only had three valves. So, was the arranger making an accommodation for the instrumentation or did he really want the octave? I'm not sure the answer is always obvious.

That brings up the related argument about whether bands should have an Eb or bass tuba player. I recall Revelli saying to a TMEA crowd years ago that no band is complete without Eb tubas. I have played in bands where we had a strong enough section to allow me to contribute most effectively by playing an F, and that worked really well for music that had meaningful divisis (the example that comes to mind is Lincolnshire Posy). In a band where I'm the only player, or the only strong player (pity that band...), I'd rather everyone play on the lower octave to make sure the band has a solid bass first.

But even then there are exceptions. In our folder right now, we have the Burden arrangement of Star Wars. It has a powerful bass line that plays very fast triplet figures on low F. It's not always in octaves. But it takes a mighty strong player to play fast triplet low F's with any clarity. I'd rather we all played it in the upper divisi (where the divisi is in octaves) than produce unrecognizable mud. I would call that a damage-control strategy, and it corresponds with my prime directive as an amateur musician: Do No Harm.

Rick "for whom the low F on the Holton is either loud or clearly articulated" Denney

[TubaRay]

Othertimes at the end of a section or piece our strongest player will drop the final note down an octive

My opinion on this is that it is just as annoying as the trumpets taking things up an octave You guys do what you wish but for my money, I'm going to play what's written.

I mostly agree with TubaTinker, here. Too often tuba players take things down an octave without regard to the intended texture of the music. I feel this is wrong. I would add, however, that I believe there are times when adding that extra depth to the chord can really enhance things, musically. Like many tuba players, I enjoy using the range I have worked so hard to attain. Usually, band literature does not allow for much exploration up high, so I try to use my best musical discretion in adding those 8 basso things. Of course, in order to be effective, the note has to be perfectly in tune. This rarely occurs with more than one person playing the note down.

[Chuck(G)]

I see the divisi octaves mostly in older arrangements, from back in the day when bands usually had both Eb and Bb tubas. I've always thought most of the upper octaves were written for the benefit of Eb bass players who only had three valves. So, was the arranger making an accommodation for the instrumentation or did he really want the octave? I'm not sure the answer is always obvious.

You'll also see meaningful divisi in concert band music from Europe, where the tradition of bass- and contrabass tubas survives.

But by and large, the composers of concert band literature are light-years behind the brass band composers, where the basses are frequently treated as independent entities with different sound characteristics.

Still, if we see a divisi section, I think it's best that we do our best to honor it.

[tubeast]

Before I think about going 8va basso, I take a look at the whole piece. If I can find any notes down in that desired region somewhere on the sheet, I usually won´t go down there on occasions other than specified in the music, because obviously the composer has added those notes where (s)he considered them beneficial to the work. Doing additional octaves ad libitum will, to my opinion, contribute to an unwanted uniformity in the piece´s character.
Plus, having listened to our band´s recordings, I found that those subcontra notes couldn´t be noticed when they hadn´t appeared in the sheet music, so that made me even more cautious when planning to do that.